Home Home   About Us About Us   Contact Us Contact Us

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes

Old 02-29-2008, 10:08 PM   #1 (permalink)
Squeeze Me
Member
 
SweetCheeks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Palm Beach, FL, USA
My Mood:
iTrader: (2)
SweetCheeks will become famous soon enoughSweetCheeks will become famous soon enough
Thanks: 57
Thanked 51 Times in 36 Posts


 
Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
I LOVE my Shiseido foundation, I use either the liquid or powder foundation from the sun protection line as it has high SPF (around 40) and it stays put and controls my oilies living in hot, humid Florida. My skin looks great, but reading about how SPFs leave a white cast makes me question using it ... would you switch, or is that just for photos?!

Old 02-29-2008, 10:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
Squeeze Me
Member
 
SweetCheeks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Palm Beach, FL, USA
My Mood:
iTrader: (2)
SweetCheeks will become famous soon enoughSweetCheeks will become famous soon enough
Thanks: 57
Thanked 51 Times in 36 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
My main love:

Shiseido Sun Protection Liquid Foundation SPF 42 PA+++ - - Nordstrom

Old 03-01-2008, 03:19 AM   #3 (permalink)
Science Geek LTD
Valued Member
 
Kuuipo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hawaii
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
Kuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 78
Thanked 918 Times in 506 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
If it has anything other than zinc or titanium, you are doing more harm than good. It can have SPF 2000 and if its avobenzene,oxybenzone or octocrylene, you are inviting free radicals below the surface of your skin which will age you faster than skipping the sunscreen altogether.
Personally, I do not buy SPF makeup. I apply a thin layer of titanium/zinc sunscreen as a primer-it is very moisturizing-wait 15 minutes, blot and apply foundation. Minerals do not degrade.

__________________
Russian/Chinese, from planet NARS, age 45. "If its pink and sparkley I will shoot it...."
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Kuuipo For This Useful Post:
Old 03-01-2008, 04:47 AM   #4 (permalink)
Science Geek LTD
Valued Member
 
Kuuipo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hawaii
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
Kuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 78
Thanked 918 Times in 506 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
2 oz:
Active Ingredients: Octinoxate 7.4%, Zinc Oxide 13.9%. Inactive Ingredients: Water, Cyclomethicone, Butylene Glycol, Dimethicone, Polymethyl Methacrylate, Dimethicone Copolyol, Polybutylene Glycol/PPG-9/1 Copolymer, Disteardimonium Hectorite, Trimethylsiloxysilicate, Dextrin Palmitate, Glycerin, Hydrogenated C6-14 Olefin Polymers, Xylitol, Methyl Gluceth-10, Glutathione, Sodium Glutamate, Zinc Myristate, Dipotassium Glycyrrhizate, Thiotaurine, Scutellaria Baicalensis Extract, Ononis Spinosa Root Extract, Ectoin, Cyclopentasiloxane, Acrylates/Dimethicone Copolymer, Isostearic Acid, Aluminum Hydroxide, Stearic Acid, Trisodium EDTA, Silica, Alcohol, BHT, Phenoxyethanol, Methylparaben, Ethylparaben, Fragrance, Titanium Dioxide.

That's a good amount of zinc. Octinoxate degrades very quickly, but zinc does not degrade at all. (oh,btw, this is Shiseido's sunscreen formula) You are safe. function changeType(tab) { document.getElementById("tab1").style.display = "none"; document.getElementById("aTab1").className = "typeOff"; document.getElementById("cellTab1").className = "cellOff"; document.getElementById(tab).style.display = "block"; if(tab == "tab1") { document.getElementById("aTab1").className = "typeOn"; document.getElementById("cellTab1").className = "cellOn"; } }

__________________
Russian/Chinese, from planet NARS, age 45. "If its pink and sparkley I will shoot it...."
Old 03-01-2008, 09:34 AM   #5 (permalink)
Squeeze Me
Member
 
SweetCheeks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Palm Beach, FL, USA
My Mood:
iTrader: (2)
SweetCheeks will become famous soon enoughSweetCheeks will become famous soon enough
Thanks: 57
Thanked 51 Times in 36 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
Thanks, good to know it's good for me to wear as it's great on my skin, doesn't clog pores, leaves a smooth finish, covers fairly well. I just didn't know if wearing a high SPF was only bad for pics or not a good idea in gerneral, though I don't see how it could be the latter? Just wanted clarification ...

Old 03-01-2008, 09:15 PM   #6 (permalink)
Science Geek LTD
Valued Member
 
Kuuipo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hawaii
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
Kuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 78
Thanked 918 Times in 506 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
If you are going to be taking pictures, use a non SPF. Or you can use powder, lots and lots of powder (because cameras love to make the middle of your forehead look really slick). Cell phone pictures are too small to be of consequence, but nice photos, any degree of spf will make your head look like it does not belong on your neck. It may look fine in person and under a light meter, but when the film is developed.......
I don't know about how it goes on digital cameras, I only know from my experience modeling-they used good, old fashioned film (photo shop did not exist).

__________________
Russian/Chinese, from planet NARS, age 45. "If its pink and sparkley I will shoot it...."
Old 03-02-2008, 08:24 PM   #7 (permalink)
Specktra Senior
Contributing Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
iTrader: (19)
rouquinne is a glorious beacon of lightrouquinne is a glorious beacon of lightrouquinne is a glorious beacon of lightrouquinne is a glorious beacon of lightrouquinne is a glorious beacon of lightrouquinne is a glorious beacon of light
Thanks: 1
Thanked 189 Times in 125 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuuipo View Post
It can have SPF 2000 and if its avobenzene,oxybenzone or octocrylene, you are inviting free radicals below the surface of your skin which will age you faster than skipping the sunscreen altogether.
this is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!!

i have been faithfully wearing sunscreen for over 25 years and most of that time, these were the only active ingredients available in sun protection products.

i am almost 48 years old and a co-worker recently thought i was 36.

free radicals are NOT BELOW the surface of your skin, they are ON it! and the singlet oxygen that is produced by sunlight hitting your unprotected skin is the primary cause of aging.

if you were a real "science geek", you would know this.

*sheesh*

__________________
Rouquinne's Makeup Missive!
Last edited by rouquinne : 03-02-2008 at 08:29 PM.
The Following User Says Thank You to rouquinne For This Useful Post:
Old 03-02-2008, 09:50 PM   #8 (permalink)
MAC Artist
Specktra Socialite
 
erine1881's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: the middle of nowhere
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
erine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond reputeerine1881 has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 0
Thanked 13,960 Times in 2,087 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
Quote:
Originally Posted by rouquinne View Post
this is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!!

i have been faithfully wearing sunscreen for over 25 years and most of that time, these were the only active ingredients available in sun protection products.

i am almost 48 years old and a co-worker recently thought i was 36.

free radicals are NOT BELOW the surface of your skin, they are ON it! and the singlet oxygen that is produced by sunlight hitting your unprotected skin is the primary cause of aging.

if you were a real "science geek", you would know this.

*sheesh*
plus, it isn't the spf that makes you photograph lighter. the only foundation that mac carries that photgraphs lighter (by 3 or more shades ) is studio fix. and guess what? theres no spf it that one. all the other foundations work great in photography, and almost all of those contain spf.

wearing an spf of 40 everyday is great. the only way to know how it photographs is to take an actual photo of yourself and see how that does. if you are happy with how it photographs, its a keeper!

Last edited by erine1881 : 03-02-2008 at 09:52 PM.
Old 03-02-2008, 10:15 PM   #9 (permalink)
Tribe Scout, Lara
 
lara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sydney, Australia
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
lara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond reputelara has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 492
Thanked 6,730 Times in 1,467 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
The 'white face' from flash isn't from SPF ingredients/titanium/zinc 95% of the time, it's from the flash blowing out and over-exposing your face.
Camera is directed at your face = flash hits your face predominantly but hits your neck and body indirectly = white face, tanned body.

If you use lots of powder ion your face and you're going to get your picture taken, you will look ghostly and have a different coloured face. Look at some FOTDs on this forum that list mineral make-up, Studio Fix, PX AnyWear etc etc etc and you'll see that their face will almost always have this dusty, ghost-like effect.
Powder foundation, loose mineral make-up, etc all refract light back and will cause your face to hotspot. Digital or film, it doesn't make a difference. The only exception are mattifying powders like Blot; due to their coarser irregular nature they don't bounce back as much light.

The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to lara For This Useful Post:
Old 03-03-2008, 12:19 AM   #10 (permalink)
Science Geek LTD
Valued Member
 
Kuuipo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hawaii
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
Kuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 78
Thanked 918 Times in 506 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
Quote:
Originally Posted by rouquinne View Post
this is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!!

i have been faithfully wearing sunscreen for over 25 years and most of that time, these were the only active ingredients available in sun protection products.

i am almost 48 years old and a co-worker recently thought i was 36.

free radicals are NOT BELOW the surface of your skin, they are ON it! and the singlet oxygen that is produced by sunlight hitting your unprotected skin is the primary cause of aging.

if you were a real "science geek", you would know this.


*sheesh*
RIVERSIDE, Calif. - Are sunscreens always beneficial, or can they be detrimental to users? A research team led by UC Riverside chemists reports that unless people out in the sun apply sunscreen often, the sunscreen itself can become harmful to the skin.
When skin is exposed to sunlight, ultraviolet radiation (UV) is absorbed by skin molecules that then can generate harmful compounds, called reactive oxygen species or ROS, which are highly reactive molecules that can cause "oxidative damage." For example, ROS can react with cellular components like cell walls, lipid membranes, mitochondria and DNA, leading to skin damage and increasing the visible signs of aging.


Two-photon fluorescence intensity images of cells deep in the epidermis showing reactive oxygen species activity following sunscreen application to the skin surface. Reactive oxygen species can react with cellular components, leading to skin damage and increasing the visible signs of aging.

UV filters (octylmethoxycinnamate, benzophenone-3 and octocrylene) widely used in sunscreens generate reactive oxygen species (ROS) in skin when exposed to ultraviolet radiation, augmenting the ROS that is naturally produced.
(Images by K. Hanson, UC Riverside)
When sunscreen is applied on the skin, however, special molecules – called UV filters – contained in the sunscreen, cut down the amount of UV radiation that can penetrate the skin. Over time, though, these filters penetrate into the skin below the surface of the epidermis, the outermost layer of skin, leaving the body vulnerable to UV radiation.
Led by Kerry M. Hanson, a senior research scientist in the Department of Chemistry at UCR, the researchers report that three UV filters (octylmethoxycinnamate, benzophenone-3 and octocrylene), which are approved by the Food and Drug Administration and widely used in sunscreens, generate ROS in skin themselves when exposed to ultraviolet radiation, thus augmenting the ROS that is naturally produced. The researchers note that the additional ROS are generated only when the UV filters have penetrated into the skin and, at the same time, sunscreen has not been reapplied to prevent ultraviolet radiation from reaching these filters.
Study results will appear in an upcoming issue of Free Radical Biology & Medicine. An advance copy of the paper is available online on the journal's Website.
"Sunscreens do an excellent job protecting against sunburn when used correctly," said Hanson, who works in the laboratory of Christopher Bardeen, an assistant professor of chemistry at UCR. "This means using a sunscreen with a high sun protection factor and applying it uniformly on the skin. Our data show, however, that if coverage at the skin surface is low, the UV filters in sunscreens that have penetrated into the epidermis can potentially do more harm than good. More advanced sunscreens that ensure that the UV-filters stay on the skin surface are needed; such filters would reduce the level of UV-induced ROS. Another solution may be to mix the UV-filters with antioxidants since antioxidants have been shown to reduce UV-induced ROS levels in the skin."
In their research, Hanson and colleagues used epidermal model tissue and applied sunscreen to the surface to test the effect of sunscreen penetration on ROS levels in the deep epidermis. A two-photon fluorescence microscope allowed them to visualize ROS generation occurring below the skin surface. The ROS activity was detected using a probe molecule whose fluorescent properties change upon exposure to ROS. On comparing images taken before and after the skin was exposed to UV radiation, they found that ROS generation in the skin increased after sunscreen penetration.
About 95 percent of the visible signs of aging are associated with UV exposure. About 90 percent of a person's total life-time UV exposure is obtained before the person is 18 years of age. Only a few UV-filters are available that block "UV-A," the wavelengths that penetrate more deeply into the skin, all the way into the dermis where collagen exists.
"For now, the best advice is to use sunscreens and re-apply them often – the Skin Cancer Foundation recommends every two hours, and especially after sweating or swimming, which can wash away sunscreen – to reduce the amount of UV radiation from getting through to filters that have penetrated the skin," Bardeen said. "This, in turn, would reduce ROS generation."
Next, the researchers plan to investigate the effect of smog on ROS generation in the skin.

__________________
Russian/Chinese, from planet NARS, age 45. "If its pink and sparkley I will shoot it...."
Old 03-03-2008, 12:22 AM   #11 (permalink)
Science Geek LTD
Valued Member
 
Kuuipo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hawaii
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
Kuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 78
Thanked 918 Times in 506 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
Quote:
Originally Posted by rouquinne View Post
this is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!!

i have been faithfully wearing sunscreen for over 25 years and most of that time, these were the only active ingredients available in sun protection products.

i am almost 48 years old and a co-worker recently thought i was 36.

free radicals are NOT BELOW the surface of your skin, they are ON it! and the singlet oxygen that is produced by sunlight hitting your unprotected skin is the primary cause of aging.

if you were a real "science geek", you would know this.

*sheesh*
You may write about makeup, but its obvious you do not keep up with chemistry or medical news.

__________________
Russian/Chinese, from planet NARS, age 45. "If its pink and sparkley I will shoot it...."
Last edited by MAC_Whore : 03-04-2008 at 01:07 PM. Reason: Removed unnecessary comment
Old 03-03-2008, 12:24 AM   #12 (permalink)
Science Geek LTD
Valued Member
 
Kuuipo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hawaii
My Mood:
iTrader: (0)
Kuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond reputeKuuipo has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks: 78
Thanked 918 Times in 506 Posts


 
Re: Wait a minute, should I be using this high SPF foundation???
Two-photon fluorescence intensity images of cells deep in the epidermis showing reactive oxygen species activity following sunscreen application to the skin surface. Reactive oxygen species can react with cellular components, leading to skin damage and increasing the visible signs of aging. Credit: K. Hanson, UC Riverside

Are sunscreens always beneficial, or can they be detrimental to users? A research team led by UC Riverside chemists reports that unless people out in the sun apply sunscreen often, the sunscreen itself can become harmful to the skin.
When skin is exposed to sunlight, ultraviolet radiation (UV) is absorbed by skin molecules that then can generate harmful compounds, called reactive oxygen species or ROS, which are highly reactive molecules that can cause "oxidative damage." For example, ROS can react with cellular components like cell walls, lipid membranes, mitochondria and DNA, leading to skin damage and increasing the visible signs of aging.

When sunscreen is applied on the skin, however, special molecules – called UV filters – contained in the sunscreen, cut down the amount of UV radiation that can penetrate the skin. Over time, though, these filters penetrate into the skin below the surface of the epidermis, the outermost layer of skin, leaving the body vulnerable to UV radiation.


UV filters (octylmethoxycinnamate, benzophenone-3 and octocrylene) widely used in sunscreens generate reactive oxygen species (ROS) in skin when exposed to ultraviolet radiation, augmenting the ROS that is naturally produced. Credit: K. Hanson, UC Riverside
Led by Kerry M. Hanson, a senior research scientist in the Department of Chemis