Revised Mac animal testing policy? :-((
- Thread starter katred
- Start date
FadBurger
Well-known member
What sucks is that clearly MAC was doing fine because we weren't all burning our faces off when we are using their products, etc. The problem is that the Chinese govt. needs everything tested before being sold in their country even if the things are clearly fine, which is the problem. I think, like some people mentioned above, animal testing can be very important but for things that are obviously unnecessary it needs to be stopped. Also we know that they have developed/are developing ways to test cosmetics that create the same reactions as on live animals but in a lab, it's just cheaper and more widespread to do it to animals, which is something I have an issue with...there is an alternative. I also believe that they need to create good conditions for animal testing, so in the least the animals don't have to have unnecessary discomfort if it must be done.
jetjet
Well-known member
Here's L'Occitane's (Au website's) position
It really helped me understand WTF is going on re:China. I think I'll still buy from them because at least they're trying to explain the situation and do something about it. They're also letting customers make up their own mind, rather than hiding behind "unless required by law".
It really helped me understand WTF is going on re:China. I think I'll still buy from them because at least they're trying to explain the situation and do something about it. They're also letting customers make up their own mind, rather than hiding behind "unless required by law".
This may be of interest:
Its a vegan blog, which comments on cruelty free products ( this meaning that the products were not tested by any company at any point during production and do not contain any ingredients that were tested by any company.)
Its a vegan blog, which comments on cruelty free products ( this meaning that the products were not tested by any company at any point during production and do not contain any ingredients that were tested by any company.)
http://www.logicalharmony.net/an-update-on-all-estee-lauder-brands-and-animal-testing/#more-10027
Not MAC, but I thought this might be of interest. Urban Decay is now selling in China too.
Urban Decay expanding into China
Urban Decay expanding into China
katred
Specktra Bestie
Was just coming to post this. I respect them for being more up front about it than Mac, but it's just further evidence that these companies' principles are in place only up to the point where they interfere with expanding their profits. Sad tidings, but I guess the size of the market outweighs any losses they'll suffer here as a result. Honestly, this whole rush to get rid of cruelty-free policies is depressing for me, as it felt like things had been moving in the right direction for the last 15 years or so.
I agree. But somehow I am more disappointed in UD than I was in MAC for starting to sell in China, because UD was pretty much the last company I would have expected to make this move. Cruelty Free is the first thing that pops up in my mind whenever I hear Urban Decay. It surely is sad to see that they'rer getting rid of what made them stand out and what was such a huge part of their image.
If it was just about expanding to other markets I'm sure there would have been alternatives, it didn't have to be China, I think. UD is not availbale here in Germany, but a lot of people love their products and buy them from overseas. Why don't they make their products available here and in other European countries first? And I doubt they can 'make a change from within' like they say in their statement. But of course I would love to be proven wrong.
I'm not as attached to UD as I am to MAC, so I think I won't buy their products anymore. I just sold my Naked Palette and 24/7 liners anyway, the only thing I'm still using is the Primer Potion, and I think I will be able to find a replacement for that.
Mabelle
Well-known member
I just read the statement release by UD and while i am sad, and disappointed (and INFURIATED with these ridiculous Chinese laws that take pleasure in inflicting pain on animals!), i see what they are saying about No one listening if your not even in the game. They need to get the citizens riled up about animal cruelty, in order for the government to ever listen, and they can't do that if they are not in China.
What I also understood is that it is the Chinese government themselves doing the testing, not UD. I don't know if this is the case with all companies, or just case specific. Regardless, it's disgusting.
Also, i would like to clarify two things; Vegan and "Cruelty Free" are not the same thing. Vegan means not only was the product not tested on animals, no ingredients were, and no ingredients come from an animal or an animal by product ex; beeswax, lanolin or carmine (and even the UD products with the vegan logo on them, some contain carmine soooooo)
Cruelty free has no set definition. Generally we assume it means not tested on animals, but even THAT is a hazy area. Example; Body shop claims to be cruelty free, but it's parent company comes from a long line of testing. Lets say another company doesn't test, but they buy ingredients from companies that do. OR in this case UD doesn't test and has "Vegan" products, but now submits their products for testing out east. The point is YOU need to find out what "Cruelty Free" means to you. E-mail the companies and see if it fits your definition.
Another thing is MAC themselves have, in the past, claimed not to test. That may be the case. But the fact is EL, their parent company did test. There for, great, you bought from what was a formerly cruelty free brand, but you are lining the pockets of animal abusers. The money goes back to the Parent company, and gets redistributed.
And just to chime in on the past topic, I am all for testing on people. In my area, we have just arrested a necrophiliac/cannibal/murderer , and he should be a prime candidate. There are enough people that commit the most horrendous violent crimes, and no I don't believe everyone can be fixed. I believe If you brutally rape and murder an 8 year old girl, you should be submitted for a lifetime of testing to make your contribution to society. I don't give a damn about your rights.
What I also understood is that it is the Chinese government themselves doing the testing, not UD. I don't know if this is the case with all companies, or just case specific. Regardless, it's disgusting.
Also, i would like to clarify two things; Vegan and "Cruelty Free" are not the same thing. Vegan means not only was the product not tested on animals, no ingredients were, and no ingredients come from an animal or an animal by product ex; beeswax, lanolin or carmine (and even the UD products with the vegan logo on them, some contain carmine soooooo)
Cruelty free has no set definition. Generally we assume it means not tested on animals, but even THAT is a hazy area. Example; Body shop claims to be cruelty free, but it's parent company comes from a long line of testing. Lets say another company doesn't test, but they buy ingredients from companies that do. OR in this case UD doesn't test and has "Vegan" products, but now submits their products for testing out east. The point is YOU need to find out what "Cruelty Free" means to you. E-mail the companies and see if it fits your definition.
Another thing is MAC themselves have, in the past, claimed not to test. That may be the case. But the fact is EL, their parent company did test. There for, great, you bought from what was a formerly cruelty free brand, but you are lining the pockets of animal abusers. The money goes back to the Parent company, and gets redistributed.
And just to chime in on the past topic, I am all for testing on people. In my area, we have just arrested a necrophiliac/cannibal/murderer , and he should be a prime candidate. There are enough people that commit the most horrendous violent crimes, and no I don't believe everyone can be fixed. I believe If you brutally rape and murder an 8 year old girl, you should be submitted for a lifetime of testing to make your contribution to society. I don't give a damn about your rights.
jetjet
Well-known member
I'm so dissapointed in Urban Decay....and rather annoyed at the time i wasted on their website planning my next haul since I won't buy MAC
To be honest, I'm not sure what to do, the brands that dont test on animals seem really hard to buy (I don't like buying makeup online if I can avoid it)
To be honest, I'm not sure what to do, the brands that dont test on animals seem really hard to buy (I don't like buying makeup online if I can avoid it)
Dominique33
Well-known member
NVEY ECO doesn't test at all : natural luxury make-up, it looks pretty !
Mac-Guy
Well-known member
Quote: Originally Posted by Pinkdollface
I'm also not really attached to the brand. I only have the naked palette and the BOS3. I like TFSI over UDPP so another vote for TFSI here!
I really hope somebody can change the mind of chinese people. It's so sad about the way animals are treated there. I have been there once and in one of the warehouses i've seen that they sold a ton of leather and fur. It was so scary to see.
I don't think the Chinese government will change their views any time soon. We are probably talking about years and years.
The only thing consumers, we, can really do - if we care about animal testing - is stop buying brands that do animal testing. This is the only logical conclusion that we can draw.
It does not help much to send this or that brand an email or bombard their facebook page if we continue to buy the products as if there is no tomorrow. There are certainly other brands that do not test on animals, though they will probably not as hip as MAC or UD.
Just to be clear, I am not pointing fingers at anyone, I am just pointing out the simplest solution that it out there.
I'm also not really attached to the brand. I only have the naked palette and the BOS3. I like TFSI over UDPP so another vote for TFSI here!
I really hope somebody can change the mind of chinese people. It's so sad about the way animals are treated there. I have been there once and in one of the warehouses i've seen that they sold a ton of leather and fur. It was so scary to see.
I don't think the Chinese government will change their views any time soon. We are probably talking about years and years.
The only thing consumers, we, can really do - if we care about animal testing - is stop buying brands that do animal testing. This is the only logical conclusion that we can draw.
It does not help much to send this or that brand an email or bombard their facebook page if we continue to buy the products as if there is no tomorrow. There are certainly other brands that do not test on animals, though they will probably not as hip as MAC or UD.
Just to be clear, I am not pointing fingers at anyone, I am just pointing out the simplest solution that it out there.
Dominique33
Well-known member
The only thing consumers, we, can really do - if we care about animal testing - is stop buying brands that do animal testing
Yes in theory that's what we ought to do. It's a question of duty or/and personal values in fact.
Yes in theory that's what we ought to do. It's a question of duty or/and personal values in fact.
Dominique33
Well-known member
Yes some companies NEVER test on animals. NVEY ECO is one, in France we have DURANCE, TERRE DE COCAGNE or SO BIO ETIC. YES TO CARROTS etc... does not test, in Germany many brands do not test, many Vegan brands come from Germany.
Natural make-up is not always good but so far I know NVEY ECO is a luxury green brand ( compact foundation around 40 €, blush around 20 € )
If we really want to, we can avoid brands that do test, exactly as we can avoid leather handbags by replacing them by hemp handbags.
The question is a am I ready to do so ? Maybe if my personal values go beyond my narcissism ( in my case ).
Natural make-up is not always good but so far I know NVEY ECO is a luxury green brand ( compact foundation around 40 €, blush around 20 € )
If we really want to, we can avoid brands that do test, exactly as we can avoid leather handbags by replacing them by hemp handbags.
The question is a am I ready to do so ? Maybe if my personal values go beyond my narcissism ( in my case ).
Elirose
New member
Thanks for asking those questions, they're really important and like you, I'll always choose to put my money behind the most ethical ones when it comes to animal testing, so I really want to know who's doing what. I look forward to seeing your reply from Mac and get ready to switch brands if necessary!
Dominique33
Well-known member
Here is a list I recently found on the Internet. I don't know if it's 100 % cruelty-free... But some products are CF and even Vegan. I am disappointed by Urban Decay because they used to be cruelty-free, more than 15 years they respected their values. Some brands go cruelty-free which is really good, but UD ? I do hope they will change their mind in the near future. Making profit, having values ok but betraying values is not acceptable.
Thanks for readinf Elirose !
Here it is :
VERNIS :
◦a England
◦American Apparel
◦Barry M
◦Beauty Without Cruelty
◦Butter London (Some old packaging lists non-vegan ingredients, but the brand is now 100% free of animal ingredients.)
◦China Glaze
◦CND/Creative
◦Color Club
◦Cult Nails
◦Deborah Lippmann (All of the polishes are vegan, but some of the hand care products are not.)
◦ELF
◦LA Colors Color Craze
◦LA Girl
◦Manic Panic
◦Models Own
◦NCLA
◦Nails Inc
◦Nina Ultra Pro
◦No Miss
◦Nubar
◦Obsessive Compulsive Cosmetics
◦Orly
◦Pop Beauty
◦Priti NYC
◦Ruby Kisses
◦Sante
◦Scotch Naturals
◦Sinful Colors
◦SpaRitual
◦Spoiled by Wet’n’Wild
◦Wet’n’Wild
◦Wet’n’Wild Fantasy Makers
◦Zoya
MARQUES :
•Bare Minerals (customer service would not comment when asked about vegan options)
•Beautisol (all but one product is vegan, and it’s being re-formulated to be vegan!)
•Christie Brinkley Skin Care (100% vegan!)
•E.L.F. Cosmetics (all cosmetics are 100% vegan, most brushes are vegan, the e.l.f. essentials line contains non-vegan brushes.)
•Earthly Body (100% vegan!)
•Garden Botanika (has lots of vegan options!)
•Glam Natural (100% vegan!)
•Joico (waiting to hear back on if they have vegan options or not)
•Jordana (has some vegan options – unable to get a list from customer service of vegan options)
•Kiss My Face (everything except their lip balms are 100% vegan!)
•Method (100% vegan!)
•NARS (Has lots of vegan options! It should be noted that they are cruelty free, but their parent company is not.)
•OPI (Has some vegan options – unable to get a list from customer service of vegan options. It should be noted that they are cruelty free, but their parent company is not.)
•Victoria’s Secret Beauty (has lots of vegan options!)
•Vitacare (everything but the gum is vegan, and it’s being reformulated to be vegan!)
•Wet’n’Wild (has lots of vegan options!)
•Yes to Carrots (has lots of vegan options!)
Thanks for readinf Elirose !
Here it is :
VERNIS :
◦a England
◦American Apparel
◦Barry M
◦Beauty Without Cruelty
◦Butter London (Some old packaging lists non-vegan ingredients, but the brand is now 100% free of animal ingredients.)
◦China Glaze
◦CND/Creative
◦Color Club
◦Cult Nails
◦Deborah Lippmann (All of the polishes are vegan, but some of the hand care products are not.)
◦ELF
◦LA Colors Color Craze
◦LA Girl
◦Manic Panic
◦Models Own
◦NCLA
◦Nails Inc
◦Nina Ultra Pro
◦No Miss
◦Nubar
◦Obsessive Compulsive Cosmetics
◦Orly
◦Pop Beauty
◦Priti NYC
◦Ruby Kisses
◦Sante
◦Scotch Naturals
◦Sinful Colors
◦SpaRitual
◦Spoiled by Wet’n’Wild
◦Wet’n’Wild
◦Wet’n’Wild Fantasy Makers
◦Zoya
MARQUES :
•Bare Minerals (customer service would not comment when asked about vegan options)
•Beautisol (all but one product is vegan, and it’s being re-formulated to be vegan!)
•Christie Brinkley Skin Care (100% vegan!)
•E.L.F. Cosmetics (all cosmetics are 100% vegan, most brushes are vegan, the e.l.f. essentials line contains non-vegan brushes.)
•Earthly Body (100% vegan!)
•Garden Botanika (has lots of vegan options!)
•Glam Natural (100% vegan!)
•Joico (waiting to hear back on if they have vegan options or not)
•Jordana (has some vegan options – unable to get a list from customer service of vegan options)
•Kiss My Face (everything except their lip balms are 100% vegan!)
•Method (100% vegan!)
•NARS (Has lots of vegan options! It should be noted that they are cruelty free, but their parent company is not.)
•OPI (Has some vegan options – unable to get a list from customer service of vegan options. It should be noted that they are cruelty free, but their parent company is not.)
•Victoria’s Secret Beauty (has lots of vegan options!)
•Vitacare (everything but the gum is vegan, and it’s being reformulated to be vegan!)
•Wet’n’Wild (has lots of vegan options!)
•Yes to Carrots (has lots of vegan options!)
Dominique33
Well-known member
"
(Boursier.com) -- Le bureau d'études Berenberg s'est penché sur les fusions-acquisitions dans le secteur des soins personnels, un segment qui devrait encore se montrer actif en la matière, en dépit de l'échec de l'OPA de Coty sur Avon. L'analyste évoque dans son étude tous les grands groupes, dont le français L'Oréal. "Le leader mondial du secteur n'a pas beaucoup de raisons de participer à l'activité de fusions-acquisitions. Il dispose du meilleur portefeuille de marques du secteur, de notre point de vue, et est déjà un acteur de poids dans la plupart des spécialités dans lesquelles il opère", selon le spécialiste, qui voit quand même quelques lacunes dans l'édifice, notamment son absence sur le marché des designers en maquillage, dans la vente directe et dans la distribution sur certaines parties de la côte est des États-Unis.
Même si son portefeuille est bien garni, Berenberg estime que L'Oréal a de grandes chances de racheter Urban Decay, une marque de maquillage qui a le vent en poupe et qui serait hautement profitable, et compléterait bien le dispositif actuel du groupe français. "C'est exactement la sorte de marque que L'Oréal pourrait rapidement globaliser", selon l'analyste, qui pense que le prix d'acquisition dépasserait 225 millions de dollars, soit le multiple de 2,8 fois le chiffre d'affaires payé par Estée Lauder pour Smashbox en 2010. En attendant, le bureau d'études a relevé de 84 à 95 euros sa valorisation du titre, en maintenant sa recommandation "conserver".
It means that l'Oréal could buyUrban Decay... It's highly probable says Berenberg audit society. That would be a very bad news indeed... ( SOURCE : Boursie.com ).
(Boursier.com) -- Le bureau d'études Berenberg s'est penché sur les fusions-acquisitions dans le secteur des soins personnels, un segment qui devrait encore se montrer actif en la matière, en dépit de l'échec de l'OPA de Coty sur Avon. L'analyste évoque dans son étude tous les grands groupes, dont le français L'Oréal. "Le leader mondial du secteur n'a pas beaucoup de raisons de participer à l'activité de fusions-acquisitions. Il dispose du meilleur portefeuille de marques du secteur, de notre point de vue, et est déjà un acteur de poids dans la plupart des spécialités dans lesquelles il opère", selon le spécialiste, qui voit quand même quelques lacunes dans l'édifice, notamment son absence sur le marché des designers en maquillage, dans la vente directe et dans la distribution sur certaines parties de la côte est des États-Unis.
Même si son portefeuille est bien garni, Berenberg estime que L'Oréal a de grandes chances de racheter Urban Decay, une marque de maquillage qui a le vent en poupe et qui serait hautement profitable, et compléterait bien le dispositif actuel du groupe français. "C'est exactement la sorte de marque que L'Oréal pourrait rapidement globaliser", selon l'analyste, qui pense que le prix d'acquisition dépasserait 225 millions de dollars, soit le multiple de 2,8 fois le chiffre d'affaires payé par Estée Lauder pour Smashbox en 2010. En attendant, le bureau d'études a relevé de 84 à 95 euros sa valorisation du titre, en maintenant sa recommandation "conserver".
It means that l'Oréal could buyUrban Decay... It's highly probable says Berenberg audit society. That would be a very bad news indeed... ( SOURCE : Boursie.com ).
UD have taken down their original statement. (probably because it was a bunch of BS, LOL)
Here's a petition you can sign
Animals Petition: Urban Decay: Refuse Animal Testing in China | Change.org
Here's a petition you can sign
Animals Petition: Urban Decay: Refuse Animal Testing in China | Change.org
Dominique33
Well-known member
Thank you very much Naynadine, signed ! ( I very often go to the " petitionsite " and I didn't see anything about UD yet, it's such a huge website, probably there will be some petitions there )
