Reader's Digest Author of the Year: Richard Dawkins for "The God Delusion"

[Life In Return]

To answer quickly, I do believe the entire Bible to be the Word of God. It is infallible and 100% true. No fairytales, no fiction. The life, death, burial, and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ are well documented. To compare Christianity to Catholicism is not good b/c simply, Catholics are largely not considered Christians and many will say they are Catholics and not Christians.

The Bible is NOT just my truth; it's THE Truth.

I haven't been a Christian all my life, but even before the Lord snatched me up, I knew there was a God. As I said earlier, to be otherwise IS foolish. I really am not impressed with the mind of Dawkins; he still has no common sense, and he's leading many astray with it. Titles mean nothing. And atheism is not new; it's been around for a minute. Why do I call it foolish ?

The fool says in his heart, There is no God...
Psalms 14:1 ESV

It's easy to not believe in God. To acknowledge there is a God means acknowledging that it is really not about you. To believe in God means you can not live for your own pleasures, and lets face it - Sinful men want to do what they want. And when I say 'sinful men', I mean every single man, woman, or child on the planet. No one is good. If you think you are good, think again. The heart of man is wicked and deceitful. It's easier to live in denial, following your own pleasures than to acknowledge there is a God and you just might be in trouble because you're not living up to His standards.

LipstickAndHate - You SHOULD be sad because you're going to die, as we all are, and you don't know where you're going. Eternity is a very long time... That is very sad indeed. Bodily death is NOT the end. Life is but a vapor and to spend it in this world thinking there is no God only to find out too late is very sad...

It always interests me how many atheists always point at the Christian as being arrogant and rude as if we have something to gain by introducing you to the One who can take you out of your sins, clean your heart, and redeem you. How is it rude that I want to see other people have the same eternal security that God has given me through His Son Jesus Christ ? I have nothing to gain, but you have much to gain.

I'm not better than anyone. I'm not necessarily special. Whatever is good in me or about me comes through Christ's imputed righteousness and none of my own, and for that, I am ever so grateful.

Atheism turn one's back on the very One who created them. That's like your own child rebelling against you and denying your very existence. How would you feel ?

Honestly, I pray that you all would come to know Christ by repenting of your sins and placing trust in Him. God is real; He exists. All you have to do is look outside. If there is any delusion, it is the delusion that there is NO God.

Grace and Peace,
Jenn

 

[*Stargazer*]

Does it ever occur to you that you may turn more people away from your God with your smugness than you attract?

 

[*Stargazer*]

LOL, I always get a kick out of hearing that Catholics aren't Christians. So who, precisely, is a Christian? Protestants only? Because last time I checked, Catholics predated Protestants by about 1400 or 1500 years.
Just because someone identifies themselves as a Catholic doesn't mean they don't mean they are a Christian. I know plenty of people who identify themselves as Methodists or Lutherans when asked what their religion is. Doesn't make them not Christians.

 

[Dark_Phoenix]

The fool says in his heart there is no God... the wise man shouts it from the top of a mountain.

I'm an Atheist. I think I have too much faith to be Christian or Muslim.

Please answer this for me:
Why does your God find the need to be praised?

Why do you dismiss other gods that you do not believe in? Why do they not exist?
....
It's the same reason I don't beleive in yours.
-------
(note: my defense of Atheism)

I'm going to believe in Mankind, unopressed by the constraints of theism. The master-slave morality of Christianity and theism in and of itself I find oppressing, Atheism is the liberation.

Mankind has been fighting and repairing against the mistakes your God made thousands of years ago; I see no divine interventions, no end of days, and we're left to clean up our world. Christianity is the blemish of mankind and it's insanity and pack morality has oppressed millions.

Atheism is bloodless. It's Christianity and theism that have killed millions. Atheism is the "peace movement"; its not inspiring, it's thought provoking. It questions and analyzes, it doesn't inspire men to march to war or for revolts in the streets.

I don't claim to know anything. I don't know for certain how the world was created or my purpose (other than to live this life to it's fullest. I'm not wasteing any more of my life praising the unknown, an invention of Man). I have no clue about many of the things on this earth. I don't think any of us can answer all the unknown questions in life.

It's only the believers who claim to know it all.

 

[GreekChick]

Actually, Christians equal Catholics, Orthodox, Protestants, etc.....
How is a Catholic not considered a Christian? I consider foolish a person who isn't open to new theories, new ideas that might make her say " Now you DO have a point on that one..."
You can't really compare not believing in God, to turning your back on a parent. A parent is THERE before you. You have proof of his/her existence, and it's not simply stated in a book.
Btw, the Bible wasn't written by God himself. It was written by human beings. You can't rely on what human beings have stated in some book to guide the rest of humanity for the 2000 years to come, as well as you own life. How is it the truth? How do we know for sure God spoke to these human beings? Especially if this book was altered drastically throughout the years.
You don't answer these questions in your posts. Instead you criticize everyone who asks. Remember, not everyone was born Christian.

 

[lipstickandhate]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Life In Return LipstickAndHate - You SHOULD be sad because you're going to die, as we all are, and you don't know where you're going. Eternity is a very long time... That is very sad indeed. Bodily death is NOT the end. Life is but a vapor and to spend it in this world thinking there is no God only to find out too late is very sad...

Uh, you totally missed the point about what made me sad. What makes ME sad, is that people such as yourself are not secure enough in their faith to keep it personal, that they constantly feel the need to share with everyone and anyone.

And fyi, not that it matters, I'm not an aetheist- although, since I'm sure youre some sort of wacko evangelical Protestant, I'm sure being a Catholic is equivalent. I actually go to mass every Sunday and donate a significant amount of my income to the Catholic church because I personally feel they do a better job with charity work than any government organization around (not that I am in agreement with everything they do and I am certainly far more socially liberal than the Church). NOT THAT IT MATTERS, however, because I do not make my faith other peoples' business, it does not inhibit me from respecting the opinions of others, and incapable of life in the real world. It also is simply a source of personal comfort and strength. I do not use it to make me feel as though I am better than everyone else and have the "inside scoop" on "this" life.

I know evangelicals are big on quoting Scripture, but it seems to me you often lose the forest through the trees: You have no idea if you're saved, that's for God and God alone to decide. You're just a Philistine, lording your faith over others, thinking it makes you part of an elite club. That you can thumb though a Bible and pull something out to support your position is not impressive, all you've proven is that you a) can read and b) can manipulate sources to suit your own ends. Everyone on the planet can do this and it does not make you particularly special or resourceful. Try again.

I don't personally care what you believe but I resent your condescending and disrespectul attitude towards myself and others on this board. I don't need someone on a MAC MESSAGE BOARD to tell me about death. When I read that, I actually spit my coffee out onto my laptop. This was a discussion about a BOOK other members found interesting and insightful, not about GOD or being "saved on Jesus." Shame on your for being too ignorant to tell the difference and highjacking the discussion anyway with this nonsense. If you haven't read the book (which I know you haven't b/c there is no way a person like you would even "blaspheme Jesus" by putting such a heretical purchase on your credit card) and have nothing to contribute other then ravings about Heaven and Hell then don't say anything at all. Its okay to not talk sometimes.

Behavoir like this gives Christians the bad name, unable to restrain yourself from discussing "Jesus" anytime, anyplace. Discretion is the better part of valor and you would do well to learn that lesson. If I were you, I would consider therapy and a healthy dose of living in the real world. I would also suggest you put your money where your mouth is and live with empathy and compassion, not with a high-handed, holier than thou smugness on internet message boards. Give yourself a rest from the "God's holy messenger" schtick.

Personally, I think you're incredibly arrogant to believe that God needs YOU to tell others about the "glory of God." Please. All your comments tell me is that you're too insecure to consider the viewpoints of others and engage in diverse discussion and still remain strong in your faith anyway. Faith and real life, faith and science, are not mutually exclusive.

 

[lipstickandhate]

Oh, I JUST re-read her comment and saw that she says Catholics are not considered Christians. Evangelicals are too much for me sometimes. It's like they go out of their way to be offensive and illogical. I have no idea how you can go through life so smug and sure of yourself. It must be tiring.

I also just read how you weren't always a Christian. How dare you deny others the choice you had? Choice and personal discovery were okay for you, but not for anyone else? They need to hurry up and get saved?

 

[Raerae]

I think I'm in love with lipstickandhate...

 

[*Stargazer*]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raerae I think I'm in love with lipstickandhate...

It's nice to see another person who can participate in a rational debate (regardless of the side they take) and present their thoughts in a functional way, isn't it?

 

[Raerae]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ladybug10678 It's nice to see another person who can participate in a rational debate (regardless of the side they take) and present their thoughts in a functional way, isn't it?

Yes, I see some lively conversation in the future.

I'm curious if Life In Return will respond with anything with substance. I'd love to see a well written response from her.

 

[lipstickandhate]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raerae I'm curious if Life In Return will respond with anything with substance. I'd love to see a well written response from her.

Me too. But I'm not holding me breath. Thanks for the kind words, ladies. I always enjoy a good debate!

 

[Dark_Phoenix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Life In Return It's easy to not believe in God. To acknowledge there is a God means acknowledging that it is really not about you. To believe in God means you can not live for your own pleasures, and lets face it - Sinful men want to do what they want. And when I say 'sinful men', I mean every single man, woman, or child on the planet. No one is good. If you think you are good, think again. The heart of man is wicked and deceitful. It's easier to live in denial, following your own pleasures than to acknowledge there is a God and you just might be in trouble because you're not living up to His standards.

It's NOT easy to not beleive in God. It means pulling yourself up and facing that you're all alone in the world; that the human experience is your and yours alone. You live, and then you die. You live life to it's fullest without worrying about the beyond.

Atheism (to the right people) is VERY strict. There's no devil, no hell, no demons... no one to blame or take responsiblility except yourself. I think that if you do what's ethical, then you're doing what's right.
Stealing, lying, cheating... unethical. But it's stupid things like sex, the whole "sabbath", and praising God that just don't make sense.

It's Christians who have ruined the world.
As Nietzsche said in The Gay Science:
"The Christian resolution to find the world ugly and bad has made the world ugly and bad."

If we all thought of the world as a place of possibility, goodness, and harmony... that man was inherently good, born neutral and untainted then maybe we wouldn't be spending so much time cleaning up for the mistakes of Christians thousands of years ago. Our environment determines our base of morality and values. An Atheist can be just as ethical than a Christian, if not moreso because when he commits a terrible act he has only himself to blame.

 

[Raerae]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emma_Frost An Atheist can be just as ethical than a Christian, if not moreso because when he commits a terrible act he has only himself to blame.

C'mon, saying 50, "Our Father's" makes everything better, no matter what you do.

 

[Dark_Phoenix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raerae C'mon, saying 50, "Our Father's" makes everything better, no matter what you do.

There's an episode of Law and Order where a man shoots a priest inside the confessional and Jerry Orbach says:
"I wonder how many Hail Mary's that takes".

But yeah, I agree. I think the Christian mindset is to try and be moral, which is impossible because man is bad, and then repent by praying. But it's still not fixing what you did.

 

[*Stargazer*]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emma_Frost There's an episode of Law and Order where a man shoots a priest inside the confessional and Jerry Orbach says: "I wonder how many Hail Mary's that takes".

I miss Lenny Briscoe.

 

[Dark_Phoenix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ladybug10678 I miss Lenny Briscoe.

We all do

I like it when they have "I Love Lenny" weeks/weekend marathons.
Did you know Jerry Orbach was in the Broadway production of Chicago?
Would have been awesome to see him *sigh*

 

[caffn8me]

Jenn, I'm presuming that as a strict bible follower you don't eat pork or shrimp and you only wear clothes woven from a single fibre for mixed fibre clothing is an abomination in the bible. Those clothes of single fibre you wear also have tassels at the edges, just like the bible says they must don't they? Deuteronomy 22: verses 11-12

I'm intrigued that you don't believe the Roman Catholic church to be christian. It is the only branch of christianity to have descended directly from the original followers of Jesus. Don't forget that Jesus was born into the Roman empire.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wikipedia The Catholic Church is the Christian Church in full communion with the Bishop of Rome, currently Pope Benedict XVI. It traces its origins to the original Christian community founded by Jesus Christ and led by the Twelve Apostles, in particular Saint Peter. The Catholic Church is the largest Christian Church and the largest organized body of any world religion.

Perhaps you can help us all out here and explain what you understand by the term "christian" because at the moment I'm sure most people here are a little confused by what you've written.

 

[Raerae]

You wont get an answer Caffn8me, people like her haven't taken the time to really research their faith and what they are talking about. She's just repeating back what she was told by someone else, w/out bothering to seek the meaning of her religion beyond that. She figures, "Oh I'm safe now and going to heaven since I've accepted Jesus into my heart" (which isn't exactly true, since you wont know until you get there even Christians go to hell). And doesn't see the need to learn any more. She's the perfect believer, one who doesn't question anything beyond the face value. And a big part of the problems we see in theism today.

 

[user79]

Good girls go to heaven.

Bad girls can go everywhere.

 

[Hawkeye]

Seems like someone is trying to get their quota in for the year on how many lives they can save.

I've said it many times- God looks at the heart and the old adage judge not least you be judged applies to christians as well. But it's OK they don't have to hear it. Many Modern day christians are nothing more than a bunch of Pharasees who don't necessarily follow the Law or the Word of God but will call anyone else on it they want to.

Quote:

I also just read how you weren't always a Christian. How dare you deny others the choice you had? Choice and personal discovery were okay for you, but not for anyone else? They need to hurry up and get saved?

As this quote says- I heavily applaud.

How DARE any Christian to NOT allow each person to find their way to Christ.

God speaks to each individual in their own way - not by a bunch of crazy Christians who try to meet the Save the Souls Quota. Most of the time when people say- Yeah fine I wanna be saved it's usually just to shut the Christian whose trying to get the quota to shut up.

But again, it's OK because they are all in their own little world of prosteletizing and trying to save souls.

Sometimes when people get mad at me because I rip apart the muslim faith it's all I can do to make the true difference.

The fanatical Muslims only kill the body and trap people in fear. The fanatical Christians kill the soul and trap them in fear.

And the later is much more dangerous.

If people would stop preaching long enough to realize what the hell Jesus really WAS talking about, and what Mohammad really WAS talking about....

You can't preach to people by words. The mouth can say anything. A person can act too.

But when there is someone who truely believes you can tell.

And that's with any religion or non religion.

I just finished reading " The God Delusion" Still didn't make me change my mind but he had his evidence and he obviously thought it out rather well.

If a person can think things out for themselves and argue their case then more power to them.