Snoop Dogg: America's most lovable pimp...

[Dizzy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Painkiller [no offense meant to the poster, just highlighting this particular idea which is still quite common thinking among a lot of people] is almost as bad as teaching little girls (via negative role models) to dress like baby prostitutes. This particular point of view doesn't sexualize little kids, sure, but it teaches them to conform to what other people want from them, and it's just as image-centric as any Bratz doll campaign.

No offense taken, but welcome!!

If you think about it, though, everyone has to conform at one time or another. You can't go to a corporate job interview with a mini-skirt and a low-cut top, both of which leave little to the imagination, and reasonably expect to get the job. We're always going to have to conform at one point or another, it's unreasonable to expect otherwise.

And on the other side of that, whose to say that you're (generic, not intended towads you) not conforming by dressing like this already. It's what the marketers want you to do, isn't it?

I could totally be missing the point though, but I'm not a person who believes that you conform through a style. Yes, there might be certain times that you are expected to dress and behave a certain way, but I'd much rather have a personality that defines me rather than a set of clothes.

 

[giz2000]

You guys need to pick up a copy of Ariel Levy's book, Female Chauvinist Pigs - Women and The Rise of Raunch Culture. My photography professor put it down as a required text (even though it has NOTHING to do with photography), and I am so glad she did...it talks about how the women's movement has basically turned on itself and how women today have actually contributed to the attitudes that you guys are discussing here...very interesting stuff!
Here's a link:

http://www.amazon.com/Female-Chauvin...e=UTF8&s=books

 

[Beauty Mark]

I've been meaning to get that book!

To answer some stuff above... ITA that you have to conform at one point or another in your life, unless you are incredibly incredibly lucky. I like youbeabitch's standard for judging sluttiness. I think there's a fine line between sexy and slutty. Sexy, to me, isn't putting it all out there.

Hip hop has a rich history and still some of it isn't bad. Outkast is considered hip hop and compare their music to that of like Akon. It can be very political. Public Enemy (that group Flava Flav was a part of- yes, that Flava Flav who's on VH1) was very political back in the day. I gave the examples of Nas, Jay-Z, and Kanye. They still use the slang, but they tell about some powerful stuff in there. Sure, Jay-Z did Big Pimpin' but there's also 99 Problems and some other songs off the Black Album.

I haven't listened to her stuff in a while, but Missy's had some good messages in her music too.

 

[Raerae]

It's not all of the music, very true. There are a lot of hip-hop songs that deal with real issues, real problems etc.

But then Pitbull comes on singing, "Bend over girl, show me what your working with!" And a lot of that meaning is lost.

As far as dressing, I totally agree with the play up your legs, belly, or boobs. But only play up one (maybe 2 depending on the setting). I had totally forgotten about that analogy.

 

[Shimmer]

Sexy doesn't need validation from a man. Sexy simply knows. To quote Rocky, sexy says "I am."

Slutty needs validation. It needs affirmation. It needs attention, and it needs it NOW. It needs petting and holding and enabling.

THAT is the difference between sexy and slutty.

 

[medusalox]

What humors/horrifys me is when I see girls, friends of mine even, dancing to songs that blatantly disrespect women. Not even just dancing, but singing along, word for word. I just want to ask them...is it really worth compromising your morals and self respect just to bust a move? I don't get it. I, myself, love a song with a good beat, and most hip hop songs have just that. But I refuse to shake my butt to a song that demeans women.

 

[Shimmer]

but see they don't GET that.
They look at it and say "It doesn't mean anything."

 

[MiCHiE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shimmer but see they don't GET that. They look at it and say "It doesn't mean anything."

Or "They're not talking about me.....". Sometime, you just want to shake their fast a$$es and say, "B----, yes they are!"

 

[Raerae]

From the windows! To the walls! Till the sweat drip down my balls!
Make all these females crawl! Skeet Skeet!

Yes, thats music today.

Chris Rock made comments about this, forgot what show it was.

 

[Beauty Mark]

I think your friends' attitudes are similar to how hip hop wives deal with that aspect.

I think the show was on E! and they were talking to some hip hop wives. The ones who aren't famous, not like Kelis or Kimora. I was surprised who was married. The wives seemed to see it as more of a joke persona, even though they didn't seem to love it; they claimed the husbands were great husbands, faithful, and great fathers.

I've read arguments that some of the music is supposed to be satirical of pimp culture. The problem is that if that's true, the satire isn't that strong, because people aren't seeing it as such

 

[MiCHiE]

^I saw that and Snoop's wife had to be the worst and dumbest one that they interviewed....It's a shame what money does to people.

 

[Hawkeye]

It really is. It's a sad thing!

I saw a VH1 special on just regular girls who were in hip hop videos and they were saying how bad it really is and how degrading it really is.

 

[amoona]

omg I saw that same VH1 show! I kinda have a thing for watching random shows on VH1 and E! haha

But anyway, like Shimmer said ... people who are into these disrespectful songs don't get that they're disrespectful! Either they don't want to get it or they just flat out don't get it.

Like the lyrics from that song Raerae quoted:

From the windows! To the walls! Till the sweat drip down my balls!
Make all these females crawl! Skeet Skeet!

I STILL don't know wtf that means! I take it fron the context it's nothing flattering but don't ask me what it means because I have no clue!

I think a lot of people, especially the women who enjoy these songs, phase out the actual words of the songs. Yes they may know it line for line but I don't think people actually listen to the words in music, especially hip-hop.

Like I said earlier, I'm not a fan of any hip-hop or rap so I don't listen to it, you wont find it on my IPOD or in my car but my boyfriend does listen to the radio and I've stopped and actually listened to some songs. I don't get it, I don't know why people listen to it. Yes I may have a bias because I'm a FOB and I only listen to Arabic music which is pretty much ALWAYS about love for a women, love for a man, or love for your country. So I don't understand how people can enjoy music that's disrespectful and degrading or music that talks about doing drugs and killing people.

 

[Raerae]

Skeet
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
The term skeet may refer to:

A clay target. (a technically incorrect usage of the term)
Skeet shooting or Clay pigeon shooting, a sport using such targets
The Olympic Skeet event
Slang for semen, or to ejaculate
Slang for a whore
Slang adjective describing anything small, short or lacking in amount.
Slang for Cocaine.

I'll let you guess which one it is.

 

[medusalox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raerae Skeet From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to: navigation, search The term skeet may refer to: A clay target. (a technically incorrect usage of the term) Skeet shooting or Clay pigeon shooting, a sport using such targets The Olympic Skeet event Slang for semen, or to ejaculate Slang for a whore Slang adjective describing anything small, short or lacking in amount. Slang for Cocaine. I'll let you guess which one it is.

Wow, any of those really wouldn't be too great used in a song lyric talking about women. *shakes head* However, know what it's slang for, and then seeing the phrase "The Olympic Skeet event"...um, wow. hehe.

 

[Raerae]

Quote:

Originally Posted by medusalox Wow, any of those really wouldn't be too great used in a song lyric talking about women. *shakes head* However, know what it's slang for, and then seeing the phrase "The Olympic Skeet event"...um, wow. hehe.

omg haha

 

[amoona]

ill that's disturbing!

 

[mzcelaneous]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beauty Mark Hip hop has a rich history and still some of it isn't bad. Outkast is considered hip hop and compare their music to that of like Akon. It can be very political. Public Enemy (that group Flava Flav was a part of- yes, that Flava Flav who's on VH1) was very political back in the day. I gave the examples of Nas, Jay-Z, and Kanye. They still use the slang, but they tell about some powerful stuff in there. Sure, Jay-Z did Big Pimpin' but there's also 99 Problems and some other songs off the Black Album.

OMG...I wish I could hit the "Thanks" button a million times. I LOVE me some hip-hop, not crappy mainstream rap.

You see...there's a big, BIG difference between present mainstream rap and underground hip-hop. They do NOT go hand-in-hand.

Rap is not hip-hop IMO. I know a lot will argue against that.

Mainstream rap is all about the material wealth, misogyny, drugs, & violence: "bling-bling", "banging hoes", & "gettin' blown/high". You know stuff you hear from Snoop Dogg, David Banner, Three 6 Mafia, Ying Yang Twins, Nelly, etc.

A lot (although not all) of hip-hop is about their verbal skills, activism, politics, unity, and yes...love. Stuff from my favorites such as De La Soul, Mos Def, Black Star, Jurassic 5, Dead Prez, Common, Nas, & A Tribe Called Quest.

Just my

 

[Beauty Mark]

I think hip hop and rap coincide a lot of the same musical elements. I think that it's up to the artist to what they will with the tools they're given. If I wanted, I could write a really misogynistic rock song (I'm sure there are some, I just can't think of any off the top of my head.) The genre isn't inherently good or bad, IMO; it's what people do with it. I think there are gems within mainstream music still, but they're overshadowed. Eminem's work in Stan was so haunting and well-done.

Playing Devil's Advocate, are words in music really just that- words? If hip hop expressed positive messages (respect everyone, don't kill people, and so on), would it affect people to behave positively? Or, to steal a little from the movie High Fidelity, do we listen to the music because of our moods/personality or are we the way we are because of the music?

I'm also not sure if the visual impact is hitting home more than the lyrical. Given how popular music videos are, I wonder if that's more important than what's being said.

 

[mzcelaneous]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beauty Mark I think hip hop and rap coincide a lot of the same musical elements. I think that it's up to the artist to what they will with the tools they're given.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beauty Mark I think there are gems within mainstream music still, but they're overshadowed. Eminem's work in Stan was so haunting and well-done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beauty Mark Playing Devil's Advocate, are words in music really just that- words? If hip hop expressed positive messages (respect everyone, don't kill people, and so on), would it affect people to behave positively?

It can be both. I'm sure not everyone will listen to a song and weave the lyrics into their daily lives. But if a person can relate to the song/lyrics, then yes, it can greatly affect them, good or bad. It depends on the person.