Virgina Tech Shooting.

[stefania905]

i try not to read the paper or news b/c i get really bad anxiety attacks cuz of an inncident that happened to me last year...

but from what i know, i am terrbily saddened by this.

prayers are with everyone

 

[Beauty Mark]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shimmer If that's all there is, why speculate?

People demand answers and some are happier with any answer, whether or not it's wrong, than waiting to hear the correct one

 

[Raerae]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shimmer If that's all there is, why speculate?

Not only that, but people like to talk, and give their opinions on what happened etc. Nothing wrong with that, as long as once the truth gets out it's properly reported.

You can't expect us to all sit quiet for weeks while they do an investigation and not talk about it.

 

[xbeatofangelx]

This is a terrible tragedy.

But why isn't it OK for asian people to worry about cultural backlash?

I personally agree, and think it's something to be worried about. While the majority of Specktra members here are very intelligent people, and probably won't hold anything against Asians, that doesn't mean that the general public will feel the same way.

Think about the backlash after 9/11. That was serious.

This is just a smaller tragedy.

My condolences to the families that were affected.

 

[Beauty Mark]

Because there hasn't been any sign of it. It was one Asian guy who had serious issues. I don't think black people had anything to fear racially because of the sniper.

9-11 (and no, I do not agree with stereotyping Muslims) involved a huge extremist organization of Middle Eastern people. Considering the US's general relations to the Middle East and the reasons behind the attacks, they had pretty good reasons to be afraid of the backlash. The US has great relations with East Asia, with the exception of North Korea. The media portrayed 9-11 as an Islamist/Middle Eastern thing. They showed pics or video of Middle Easterns celebrating. I haven't seen any East Asians jumping for joy. This has been portrayed as a crazy student, much like the Columbine shootings.

I readily believe there are a lot of dumb people in this world, but I think most of them can tell the difference between something that was fairly isolated and something that has huge political connotations. I think people are being pre-emptively too defensive about something that might not happen and are comparing two totally different situations.

 

[xbeatofangelx]

You're definitely right. They are being pre-emptively defensive. It also sucks that they should feel that way.

 

[KeshieShimmer]

I can hardly study. I just needed to turn off the news. I'm so so pissed. That shooter better be glad that he died. He would had been murdered or died later on anyways.

I just feel so helpless.

 

[blueyedlady87]

I'd like to think I would 'do something' if something like this were to happen to me, but the truth is that these kids were sitting in class not expecting a crazy man to come in and shoot them. When you're caught off-guard like that, what can you do? I mean they were probably terrified and went into shock.

I feel that the school didn't do all they could to prevent this. The shooter's plays he wrote while in school were posted and they are awful. He was sent to a counselor, but they won't say what else was done. He refused to give his name in class, wouldn't talk to anyone, and teachers described him as 'troubled.' His own roomate said he never talked. He lit fire to something, stalked women, and got a speeding ticket for going over twice the speed limit. And yet nothing was done????? Furthermore, how was he raised to think any of that behavior was normal? Did his parents just not get him the help he needed?

The note he left spoke of hate for 'rich kids' 'harletans' and said that people made him do this. Um, excuse me but it was not like he tried to make friends. Even teachers were scared of him. He never had a girlfriend or friends b/c he didn't talk to anybody!

And why on earth was that school not put in lockdown after the first shooting? Even if was 'domestic' it's a freaking shooting on school campus!!! I mean, that's not business as usual! And notifying people through e-mail!!!??? What of people who were in their cars, whose computer was down, or who don't check email regularly?? I mean everything the President of that school says seems like a poor excuse. When this is down I hope he resigns along with the Security/police chief who kept changing his story during (I believe) the 2nd press conferennce. I mean the guy came across as an idiot!

These killings were so senseless, so unnecessary. Why do these kids have to take so many other lives before killing themselves? It seems so selfish and cowardly to me.

Guess I'm asking more questions than answering. As a soon-to-be college student this really bothered me, I can only imagine what the people there are going through.

My prayers are with them.

 

[blueyedlady87]

Quote:

Originally Posted by xbeatofangelx This is a terrible tragedy. But why isn't it OK for asian people to worry about cultural backlash? I personally agree, and think it's something to be worried about. While the majority of Specktra members here are very intelligent people, and probably won't hold anything against Asians, that doesn't mean that the general public will feel the same way. Think about the backlash after 9/11. That was serious. This is just a smaller tragedy. My condolences to the families that were affected.

I think you have such a good point! After 9/11 the Middle-eastern community faced serious backlash, they still do. In my community alone many businesses were vandalized because they had 'muslim' owners. The sad part- some of them were Christian. When I first heard they identified him as an Asian man, my first thought was, here we go. Why define him at all?? Just release his name and picture! Is it necessary to go, 'the shooter has been identified as an Asian man nammed Cho Seung' I long for the day when we can drop "White, Asian, Black, Mexican' and just be humans.

It's equally sad for all cultures.

 

[Beauty Mark]

I'm not sure what the school could have done about him, pre-shooting... If his writing didn't directly describe how he was going to shoot people or directly harm people, he's probably protected by freedom of speech. Being troubled and isolating oneself isn't enough for a school to force him into therapy. They would have to have sound proof that he was threat to himself (like going to kill himself) or others. A lot of schools really are careful about that, because Mommy and Daddy may intervene and sue them because they don't think their kid needs help.

The thing is with the writings- I read one of them, and while it is grotesque, think of the published works and movies that are equally appalling or worse (American Psycho came to mind). The author isn't always using him/herself in the work; Nabokov wasn't a pedophile, for instance. Think about the people who create the really graphic video games. Writing something horrifying doesn't always mean you're going to go out and shoot people.

I don't know how the dorms operate there, but it surprised me that there wasn't a sign in log or something of that nature; most large dorms have a whole procedure for that. I would consider that a screw up, as well as not canceling classes. Even if it is a large school and they believed it was an isolated incident, I think a dual murder is sound reason to cancel classes.

Quote:

Why define him at all?? Just release his name and picture! Is it necessary to go, 'the shooter has been identified as an Asian man nammed Cho Seung'

It's a standard news thing. I'm not sure why, but they've described most criminals as a race/nationality and even more than that, if they're something strange, like if they're dirty or really tall and lanky.

 

[lipstickandhate]

I really don't think there are going to be any pogroms against Asians in the next couple of weeks. I think people need to stop trying to make this about themselves or their own agendas and simply be empathetic to the families who lost children and siblings.

It makes me sick that this has been spun so fast. Everyone is worried about gun control, Asians, and comparing it to other atrocities to point out that its "not so bad." I like how atrocity must be measured against others to evaluate its true worth. Ugh.

If you can't be kind and just care, at least have the respect and common sense to just be quiet.

 

[aeni]

Quote:

Originally Posted by barbie_doll_713 And why on earth was that school not put in lockdown after the first shooting? Even if was 'domestic' it's a freaking shooting on school campus!!! I mean, that's not business as usual! And notifying people through e-mail!!!??? What of people who were in their cars, whose computer was down, or who don't check email regularly??

My school wasn't put on lockdown when we had a recent on campus shooting and death. It wasn't put on lockdown when a girl in the dorm next to my department was raped. I wasn't attending the school when a random man came into a nursing class and killed 3 teachers while allowing the students to leave, but the surrounding buildings were evacuated. The University however, continued classes.

And it's not like the University is going to call all 26000 students to not come to school. Not like everyone's going to be listening to the radio (Sirius, MP3, CDs, or walking/biking to school). What's the 1 thing that everyone in college has (and is a requirement)? Internet and email.

 

[blueyedlady87]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeni My school wasn't put on lockdown when we had a recent on campus shooting and death. It wasn't put on lockdown when a girl in the dorm next to my department was raped. I wasn't attending the school when a random man came into a nursing class and killed 3 teachers while allowing the students to leave, but the surrounding buildings were evacuated. The University however, continued classes. And it's not like the University is going to call all 26000 students to not come to school. Not like everyone's going to be listening to the radio (Sirius, MP3, CDs, or walking/biking to school). What's the 1 thing that everyone in college has (and is a requirement)? Internet and email.

I don' think a school should be on lockdown for rape (not like your going to have mass rapes). But that shocks me that your school wasn't on lockdown for the other things you mentioned!! I think any threat and certainly any shooting or violence was enough to lockdown a school. Teachers could have sent students away from class, maybe less would have died that way. At the least doors should have been locked and students evacuated how they did today at the Georgia school who recieved a bomb threat. Maybe a teacher should have gone door to door to warn kids. There's no easy answer. But to have class like usual after there had been a double-homicide with a shooter on the loose is gross negligence to me.

 

[xbeatofangelx]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lipstickandhate I really don't think there are going to be any pogroms against Asians in the next couple of weeks. I think people need to stop trying to make this about themselves or their own agendas and simply be empathetic to the families who lost children and siblings. It makes me sick that this has been spun so fast. Everyone is worried about gun control, Asians, and comparing it to other atrocities to point out that its "not so bad." I like how atrocity must be measured against others to evaluate its true worth. Ugh. If you can't be kind and just care, at least have the respect and common sense to just be quiet.

I think that it's possible to have two different kinds of emotions at one time =_=...

Thanks for insinuating that a bunch of people in the United States "don't care" about this tragedy, just because they can think about two things at once. I think it's OK to think about yourself in times of worry. Are you asking me to not express my feelings?

I, for example, already stated my condolences to the people affected, but it seems like you're telling me it's not ok to think about how it will affect me, or at least express my opinion on a public forum.

::sadface:: =[

 

[Tash]

How are you going to lock down a campus that is more than three times the size of Central Park? I mean seriously, that's not even feasible.

 

[MxAxC-_ATTACK]

It isn't everyone else's job to keep you safe. Its your own job.. People are just looking to point fingers at someone. There isn't anything ANYONE could have done to prevent this..Not the Dean of the school, Not the police,Not the President... No one.. If he didn't use a gun, he would have made a bomb, he could have used a car to kill several people, there are other means of killing people besides shooting them.You can prohibit the use of guns, that does NOT mean that people wont still have means of getting them.. Do people still buy pot in the states? Hell yes they do, Is it illegal ? yep. ,... Do you speed in your car? Is that Illegal.. sure is. .. Is murdering several people Illegal? yes ma'am, did it still happen? sure did.
The boy was crazy, and Yes he wrote disturbing plays, etc, but its not like the teachers could have had in imprisoned for it, since he technically was not doing anything. He was a troubled boy, if he wanted to kill someone he was gonna do it , whether the people were informed of it, or not.. Its your OWN responsibility to keep yourself safe.
This is a seriously tragic event, tragic events happen with out warning, people are disgusting. For me thinking that someone had that type of mentality to kill people execution style like he was playing Quake on his PC is disturbing. and It could be ANYONE. You never really know.. no one does.

 

[Shimmer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by blueyedlady87 I'd like to think I would 'do something' if something like this were to happen to me, but the truth is that these kids were sitting in class not expecting a crazy man to come in and shoot them. When you're caught off-guard like that, what can you do? I mean they were probably terrified and went into shock.

You'd be surprised how paralyzed you would be. It's easy to armchair quarterback, and if that's what you want to do that's fine, but certainly understand that if you've nothing in life to base your statement on, it's pure speculation.
Quote:

I feel that the school didn't do all they could to prevent this. The shooter's plays he wrote while in school were posted and they are awful. He was sent to a counselor, but they won't say what else was done. He refused to give his name in class, wouldn't talk to anyone, and teachers described him as 'troubled.' His own roomate said he never talked. He lit fire to something, stalked women, and got a speeding ticket for going over twice the speed limit. And yet nothing was done????? Furthermore, how was he raised to think any of that behavior was normal? Did his parents just not get him the help he needed?

He's an adult. THEY CAN'T SAY WHAT WAS SAID/DONE in the counselor's office, it's ILLEGAL. And, it's NOT illegal to not talk to anyone. If you're going to say "LOOK AT HIS PLAYS! He's crazy!" then, so are the writers for Saw1/2/3, Hostel, The Hills Have Eyes, The Shining, etc.
Quote:

The note he left spoke of hate for 'rich kids' 'harletans' and said that people made him do this. Um, excuse me but it was not like he tried to make friends. Even teachers were scared of him. He never had a girlfriend or friends b/c he didn't talk to anybody!

Did you know him? Were you there? Were you aquainted with him? Did you ever have the opportunity to extend any kind of greeting or salutation his way? Did you ever contact him? Were you someon who encountered him in daily life? If you weren't, you're making a statement on the (often misleading) impressions of other people.
Quote:

And why on earth was that school not put in lockdown after the first shooting? Even if was 'domestic' it's a freaking shooting on school campus!!! I mean, that's not business as usual! And notifying people through e-mail!!!??? What of people who were in their cars, whose computer was down, or who don't check email regularly?? I mean everything the President of that school says seems like a poor excuse. When this is down I hope he resigns along with the Security/police chief who kept changing his story during (I believe) the 2nd press conferennce. I mean the guy came across as an idiot!

Shutting down an entire campus of a double homicide isn't SOP for ANY LEOA. Any.
Additionally, you're looking at this situation with the 20/20 vision of HINDSIGHT. He didn't have a crystal ball. NO ONE could have predicted, nor suspected, nor had some sort of ESP that the murderer would have gone on a rampant killing spree across campus. If campus has to shut down because of a double homicide, the entire city of New York should be at a standstill DAILY. This logic is wholly fallible. It's easy to armchair quarterback and look over everything that HAS happened and say WouldaCouldaShoulda but until you're the one making those decisions, you haven't slightest idea what other factors were and are considered.
Quote:

These killings were so senseless, so unnecessary. Why do these kids have to take so many other lives before killing themselves? It seems so selfish and cowardly to me. Guess I'm asking more questions than answering. As a soon-to-be college student this really bothered me, I can only imagine what the people there are going through. My prayers are with them.

Of course it's selfish and cowardly. Their intent is to cause the world as much pain as the world has caused them. Sometimes they actually accomplish it. This time, he did.

 

[Beauty Mark]

Thanks to whomever pointed out the size of the campus; I didn't know it was that large. I went to a small liberal arts school, and I think if someone had been murdered on campus, we would've been on a lockdown.

I'm glad a prof pointed out that "there was violence in Cho's writing -- but there is a huge difference between writing about violence and behaving violently." The play I read was no worse than some of the horror/slasher flicks that came out this past year. I think people are, understandably, trying to find a reason, a clue, something so that they feel like they have control over the situation and can prevent it from happening. Unfortunately, I don't think there is a real way to controlling something like this.

I think the problem with people's impressions of others in the aftermath is that (and I don't blame them) they're biased. You want the victims to be have been good people and the shooter to be villainous. He has be evil and not like us at all. I imagine he was a severely disturbed individual needing help he didn't get, for whatever reasons, but as Shimmer said, we don't know him.

What I'm trying to figure out is why no one related him or who knew him outside of the school has come around. I know it would be difficult, but he had to have some family or family friends in this country. He was a student, so he probably was a dependent- where are the parents or guardians?

 

[Shimmer]

I believe they were trying to nudge him to get help, IIRC.

 

[as_cute_as_pie]

i don't know if this has already been mentioned but you can read 2 of his 'plays' on AOL.