Virgina Tech Shooting.

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by blueyedlady87 Ok. Fine. The school is completely innocent. Maybe a lockdown wasn't reasonable but all the students interviewed in the classrooms weren't even aware there was a shooting. Cho stalked 3 women which was reported to campus police, his roomates said he had an invisible girlfriend who called him Spanky, he lit a fire in his dorm, he was hospitalized for mental illness, his plays were terribly violent, he was reported to counselors by his teacher, he refused to give his name in another class. He was a ticking time bomb!! But of course this is America and we couldn't forcibly 'help' him because O no that would be taking away his rights! (Like those people he killed didn't have rights) Have you ever seen a commitment hearing? It's almost impossible. But still nothing was really done. And to that person who asked if I knew him? I'm glad to say I didn't. I made the comments based on what nearly everyone said of him, he hated people and wouldn't talk to people, his suicide note mentioned how everyone was so mean to him. That's ridiculous. Until we wake up and smell the frickn roses here in the US stuff like this will keep happenings. Give it a couple years and this will be topped. What would I have done? I dunno, why didn't those girls press charges on him when he stalked them? Where was his family and what did they do to him? Was is the schools fault? No, but in my opinion there was some degree of negligence. I'm just sick of people sympathizing with these shooters.

No one is sympathizing with any shooters.
Like it or not, we can't, and shouldn't, do away with the Bill of Rights in the name of prevention.


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Originally Posted by ThiiicknSecksii Sorry, but am i the only person who does not feel sorry for this school? i feel like the school brought it onto themselves.

Yeah, you probably are.


They did all they could.
People need to stop looking at this through hindsight. It's not going to do any good.

 

[Beauty Mark]

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Originally Posted by ThiicknSeskii This guy needed help and if the teachers and students didn't call him weird a loner, loser...got security onto him called the cops he could had got this help. the students and teachers both sounded like little pussies to me, his roommates heard him play the song shine by collective soul if you knew that song you'd know its a pretty deep song (to me anyways) and playing it over and over again was just calling out for help, yeah they where scared of him but so what? sometimes you have to be tough...and these plays and poems did they ever think this could had happened to him as a child? instead of saying drop English they maybe could had helped him. they had so many chances to prevent this and they didn't instead they thought calling the police not showing up to class so he KNOWS hes not wanted was going to help? No.

Everyone did as much as they could. Legally, they have a lot of restrictions. You CANNOT force anyone into therapy until there's black and white proof that they'll hurt others or commit suicide. The school has to toe the line on the law, for a lot of reasons. It wasn't like he wrote a play with detailed plans.

Stalking is also a grey area when it comes to the law. From my experience, it's really hard to make anything stick with it and you need very solid proof.

From the reports, it sounds like he wasn't receptive to therapy or help. You really can't help those who refuse it. Some of what he wrote may have reflected upon his life, some of it may be stuff he thought up. The profs made a decision; I'm don't think it was a great decision but I don't think it was a poor decision, either. If that kid is as crazy as he's being portrayed, keeping him in the major wouldn't help.

I'm not sympathetic towards him or his actions, but I can at least sort of understand it if the VA Tech students made his life a living hell. It doesn't make the shootings at all justifiable, of course, but it would certainly clue people in. But there hasn't been any proof of that, so I'm doubtful anyone has a reason to be sympathetic towards him.

 

[Shimmer]

I've read those plays.
They're NOTHING..and I do mean NOTHING...on Hostel, Saw, The Hills Have Eyes, Pulp Fiction, hell, even Nightmare on Elm Street.

Wes Craven and Quentin Tarantino should have been locked up YEARS ago. Yikes.

 

[Beauty Mark]

Lots of writers should have if that were the criteria for a jailable offense. I only read the one, and it was like "Is that it?"

People seem to forget how much violence there is in writing/art and has been.

 

[knoxydoll]

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Originally Posted by ThiicknSeskii his roommates heard him play the song shine by collective soul if you knew that song you'd know its a pretty deep song (to me anyways) and playing it over and over again was just calling out for help

I'm pretty sure the vast majority (at least among my friends) of teenagers and young adults will agree that they've played a song on repeat for hours. Why because they liked the song and it brought the some sort of solace. Just because the song was a depressive/deep song doesn't give you any indication that someone will go on a murderous rampage. Look at the band, they've listened to the song problem 1000s of times, and none of them have killed anyone (Well Not that I know of).
If repeating a deep/depressive song over and over again then we're in great danger of all the emo kids going out and killing everyone sometime soon.

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Originally Posted by ThiicknSeskii and these plays and poems did they ever think this could had happened to him as a child?

Just because someones poems and plays are morbid and weird to some people does not mean they're a danger to society. Writting is a release for a lot of people and makes them feel better. My friend Jaime is a prime example of someone who writes some pretty weird stuff, but you know what? She's the happiest, least violent person I know. If the stuff he wrote about had happened to him as a child and was still tormenting his soul now, he could have search for help himself. The USA has so many places that offer counseling with anonymity, I don't even live there and I can already think of a few. To say that someones writing is a way to judge their mental health is wrong, because if it is then every single horror novelist, director, writer is in need of counselling. Where would we be with movies and novels if these people had not been allowed to write? We be stuck with a whole lot of non-violent, uber-peacful books and I for one would not want that.
Sometimes the world needs a little horror and wrongness to balance the rightness.


Now saying all that. The kid really did need help, but as many other have said you can't force someone into helping themselves if they truly don't want to be helped.

 

[Shimmer]

I read both of them, and they are so poorly written, and just...juvenile...that had I been in his class, I probably would have laughed at it. That's horrible, but I would have. I did yesterday. :/

Like I said hindsight is a very interesting thing, b ut it will cast bias on situations like this and preclude people from necessarily clearly seeing what is going on. :/

 

[Beauty Mark]

Shimmer, I laughed at the one I read. It would've made one of those awesomely bad horror movies. I didn't feel like reading the second one, because I figured it would be similar to the one I read (the one where the kid has issues with his stepfather).

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Just because someones poems and plays are morbid and weird to some people does not mean they're a danger to society.

Stephen King came to mind; he seems to be an all right individual. I'm not terribly familiar with his work, but what I've seen is horrifying.

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The USA has so many places that offer counseling with anonymity, I don't even live there and I can already think of a few.

Considering that he was in college, the school would've offered it for free probably. Counseling in the US is anonymous always, and having been to counseling, the people who are there in the waiting room aren't going to be going "Guess who I saw going to therapy?"

 

[knoxydoll]

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Originally Posted by Beauty Mark having been to counseling, the people who are there in the waiting room aren't going to be going "Guess who I saw going to therapy?"

I know what you mean there. I went to therapy after my father died cause I was young and it was the second death of someone whom I was close with within 8 months. And you're not going to say who was in the waiting room because you don't really want to prove that you were there too. At least for me that was why.

 

[*Stargazer*]

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Originally Posted by Beauty Mark I'm not sympathetic towards him or his actions, but I can at least sort of understand it if the VA Tech students made his life a living hell. It doesn't make the shootings at all justifiable, of course, but it would certainly clue people in. But there hasn't been any proof of that, so I'm doubtful anyone has a reason to be sympathetic towards him.

And the social issues at a large state college are so vastly different from those in high school that its almost impossible for me to believe that he was the target of any kind of harassment from VA Tech students. Maybe random people in his classes made fun of him, but honestly it sounds like they were all just steering clear of him because he was a sullen a-hole.

I am disgusted that anyone would blame the victims in this. You can't take all of the things we know about this guy and say "Oh look, we should have sent this guy to a mental ward long ago" for the simple fact that in the moment, people who he was dealing with didn't know everything that we know. All the facts now make it look like he needed more help than he got, but it also appears that he got mental help and was on meds. Unfortunately, we can't forcibly medicate people with mental problems in this country. More and more it sounds like this guy had a legitimate mental illness and sometimes nothing can be done about that.

 

[hoemygosh]

when i heard about that shooting, i sort of had that same feeling when it was 9/11 (& i had the same kind of feeling when Anna Nicole Smith died as well), it stops you in your tracks because its so freakin tragic. my heart goes out to all the families of the victims of this shooting. <3