California - Prop 8 - PASSED
- Thread starter xxManBeaterxx
- Start date
SuSana
Well-known member
Quote:
IIRC the marriages that already occurred won't be valid anymore.
Originally Posted by TISH1127
I'm interested too...How does this affect the couples that are already married? Or does it? I have to be honest I haven't really kept up with this particular prop...But I have always supported the right to choose. |
IIRC the marriages that already occurred won't be valid anymore.
SuSana
Well-known member
Quote:
Ok let me quote myself to edit that I heard that somewhere but I read right now that supposedly nobody knows what will happen with the marriages that already happened, there is no decision.
| Originally Posted by SuSana
IIRC the marriages that already occurred won't be valid anymore. |
Ok let me quote myself to edit that I heard that somewhere but I read right now that supposedly nobody knows what will happen with the marriages that already happened, there is no decision.
melozburngr
Well-known member
SuSana- I read that the would be null somewhere too, I cant remember where tho- its been a while.
I hope that is not the case.
I hope that is not the case.
TISH1124
Well-known member
California's attorney general, Jerry Brown, has said he believes that the marriages will remain valid, but Geoff Kors, the executive director of Equality California, a gay rights group that opposes Proposition 8, said he expected challenges.
They said over the past 5 days they performed the highest rate of marriages in their history.
They said over the past 5 days they performed the highest rate of marriages in their history.
MAC_Pixie04
Well-known member
This issue infuriates me. All they wanna do is fucking get married! What is the big goddamn deal?? And I'm sick to death of the rationalizations people come up with for agreeing with overturning it.
"Let's protect the sanctity of marriage," "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve," blah blah blah. How's this for protecting the sanctity of marriage:
1. Those heterosexual blabbermouths cheating on their spouses and having affairs behind theirlovers backs; how could they forget that that's one of the 10 commandments, since they wanna lean so hard on the bible.
2. How about all those quickie Vegas weddings that end in annulments three days later? Oh yes, marriage is so sacred that Britney Spears can have one that lasts 55 hours long "just to see how it felt."
3. Open marriages are a lot more common than you think; why get married to someone and take those vows and promises of exclusive love if you'll give the okay for each other to go out and fuck other people?
4. Our divorce rate is so high it sickens me; and that hardly includes homosexual couples because only one or two states allow them to marry in the first place, let alone get divorced.
5. Have you checked craigslist lately? Military men and women actively seek no strings attached partners to agree to fake a marriage in order to collect extra money and benefits for being a married couple. They get married on paper, but lead their lives otherwise normally except for in front of their other military buddies and colleagues so that they don't get caught. What a celebration of traditional marriage.
6. The out-of-wedlock baby boom! It's fantastic; I don't knock people for having babies out of wedlock, I don't give a shit what you do. But don't be so self-righteous that you wanna deny homosexual couples the right to marry and adopt children who need homes while you run around and breed like there's no tomorrow without even half a thought about marriage.
There IS no more sanctity left in marriage, in my opinion, especially when there are people who would go out of their way to paint their entire van, house and front yard and even parade their children in support of this Prop 8 nonsense, which is not just an issue of gay rights vs straight rights. It's fucking HUMAN rights. All they want to do is get married and receive the same rights as every other married couple...and get this? IT'S A FAIR SHOT THAT THEY ARE ACTUALLY SERIOUS ABOUT IT! What a concept...a group that wants to get married for the real reasons of getting married, and we don't wanna let them. Land of the free my ass.
I'm done being angry now
"Let's protect the sanctity of marriage," "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve," blah blah blah. How's this for protecting the sanctity of marriage:
1. Those heterosexual blabbermouths cheating on their spouses and having affairs behind theirlovers backs; how could they forget that that's one of the 10 commandments, since they wanna lean so hard on the bible.
2. How about all those quickie Vegas weddings that end in annulments three days later? Oh yes, marriage is so sacred that Britney Spears can have one that lasts 55 hours long "just to see how it felt."
3. Open marriages are a lot more common than you think; why get married to someone and take those vows and promises of exclusive love if you'll give the okay for each other to go out and fuck other people?
4. Our divorce rate is so high it sickens me; and that hardly includes homosexual couples because only one or two states allow them to marry in the first place, let alone get divorced.
5. Have you checked craigslist lately? Military men and women actively seek no strings attached partners to agree to fake a marriage in order to collect extra money and benefits for being a married couple. They get married on paper, but lead their lives otherwise normally except for in front of their other military buddies and colleagues so that they don't get caught. What a celebration of traditional marriage.
6. The out-of-wedlock baby boom! It's fantastic; I don't knock people for having babies out of wedlock, I don't give a shit what you do. But don't be so self-righteous that you wanna deny homosexual couples the right to marry and adopt children who need homes while you run around and breed like there's no tomorrow without even half a thought about marriage.
There IS no more sanctity left in marriage, in my opinion, especially when there are people who would go out of their way to paint their entire van, house and front yard and even parade their children in support of this Prop 8 nonsense, which is not just an issue of gay rights vs straight rights. It's fucking HUMAN rights. All they want to do is get married and receive the same rights as every other married couple...and get this? IT'S A FAIR SHOT THAT THEY ARE ACTUALLY SERIOUS ABOUT IT! What a concept...a group that wants to get married for the real reasons of getting married, and we don't wanna let them. Land of the free my ass.
I'm done being angry now
carandru
Well-known member
I can see how this would not pass as I feel the issue of gay marriage is deeply religious based as the notion of marriage initially was religious based as well. Now, if it were on the ballot then most people going on religious values will vote against gay marriage simply b/c they cannot vote for it. That would be supporting something they don't believe in. And, I don't believe you should support something you don't believe in.
My real question is why is this even on the GD ballot in the first place? If you give rights to one person, how can you justify not giving the same rights to another person? I feel you are asking for permission to discriminate against someone and that should never be allowed on the ballot. Moreover, I don't really feel that you can discriminate against homosexuals w/o using some religious backing. And since we as a nation are supposed to separate church and state, how can you justify using religion as your reason? Either way, I am really upset that this was even on the ballot.
My real question is why is this even on the GD ballot in the first place? If you give rights to one person, how can you justify not giving the same rights to another person? I feel you are asking for permission to discriminate against someone and that should never be allowed on the ballot. Moreover, I don't really feel that you can discriminate against homosexuals w/o using some religious backing. And since we as a nation are supposed to separate church and state, how can you justify using religion as your reason? Either way, I am really upset that this was even on the ballot.
NutMeg
Well-known member
If gay marriage shouldn't be allowed because marriage is/started as a religious institution, and this should be between a man and a woman... I would argue that only Christian/Jewish/Islamic couples (did I hit all of the religions that would probably be included in that umbrella of having marriage as a religious institution?) should be allowed to be married. If it's because it's a religious institution, then don't let non-religious people marry.
That being said, I as a non-religious person can be married to any man of my choosing. I think it's a bad argument personally.
That being said, I as a non-religious person can be married to any man of my choosing. I think it's a bad argument personally.
carandru
Well-known member
Quote:
O, I completely agree and you raised valid points. I don't think you SHOULD be able to us it as an argument, but that doesn't stop those who do unfortunately.
And as a religious person, I'm still offended that this was on the ballot, but not surprised that is passed.
| Originally Posted by NutMeg
If gay marriage shouldn't be allowed because marriage is/started as a religious institution, and this should be between a man and a woman... I would argue that only Christian/Jewish/Islamic couples (did I hit all of the religions that would probably be included in that umbrella of having marriage as a religious institution?) should be allowed to be married. If it's because it's a religious institution, then don't let non-religious people marry. That being said, I as a non-religious person can be married to any man of my choosing. I think it's a bad argument personally. |
O, I completely agree and you raised valid points. I don't think you SHOULD be able to us it as an argument, but that doesn't stop those who do unfortunately.
MAC_Pixie04
Well-known member
Quote:
It's the way that it was worded; Gay marriage became legal in California earlier this year (i believe for the 2nd time?) and everybody who opposed that felt that it wasn't fair that there was no vote on the issue. That's when decided to introduce Prop 8, so that there was a "vote" on the issue. But it wasn't a vote on whether to continue to allow gay marriage, but to BAN gay marriage. It was poorly worded, campaigns were very confusing on what vote meant what result, and I HATE HATE HATE that the side that wanted to ban gay marriage used children in their advertisements. Children have absolutely 0% to do with whether or not gay people should have the right to marry. And marriage, gay or straight, is not supposed to be taught in schools. I don't remember ever learning about marriage in school, and when I worked at an elementary school, I never ever saw anything about marriage, heterosexuality or homosexuality in any of the curriculums in any of my classes. The Yes on Prop 8 Coalition played a disgusting, dirty political game with those campaigns. And who the fuck cares if your child happens to see a gay couple in public. Do you think by not letting them marry that it's going to stop them from being gay? Sexual orientation is NOT something that has social control; you can't STOP someone from being gay or straight any more than you can stop them from being black or white, or male or female. The fact that people want to viciously tear away anybody's rights is just wrong. I thought this country was headed in a more progressive direction, but the passing of Prop 8 is making me think twice about that. Especially when I consider that had I been alive over 40 years ago, I wouldn't have been able to marry my Jewish-Mexican boyfriend without a Supreme Court battle.
It's just so wrong
| Originally Posted by carandru
Well, I guess I can see it both ways. I can see how this would not pass as I feel the issue of gay marriage is deeply religious based as the notion of marriage initially was religious based as well. Now, if it were on the ballot then most people going on religious values will vote against gay marriage simply b/c they cannot vote for it b/c that would be supporting something they don't believe in. And, I don't believe you should support something you don't believe in. My real question is why is this even on the GD ballot in the first place? If you give rights to one person, how can you justify not giving the same rights to another person? I feel you are asking for permission to discriminate against someone and that should never be allowed on the ballot. Moreover, I don't really feel that you can discriminate on homosexuals w/o using some religious backing. And since we as a nation are supposed to separate church and state, how can you justify using religion as your reason? Either way, I am really upset that this was even on the ballot. |
It's the way that it was worded; Gay marriage became legal in California earlier this year (i believe for the 2nd time?) and everybody who opposed that felt that it wasn't fair that there was no vote on the issue. That's when decided to introduce Prop 8, so that there was a "vote" on the issue. But it wasn't a vote on whether to continue to allow gay marriage, but to BAN gay marriage. It was poorly worded, campaigns were very confusing on what vote meant what result, and I HATE HATE HATE that the side that wanted to ban gay marriage used children in their advertisements. Children have absolutely 0% to do with whether or not gay people should have the right to marry. And marriage, gay or straight, is not supposed to be taught in schools. I don't remember ever learning about marriage in school, and when I worked at an elementary school, I never ever saw anything about marriage, heterosexuality or homosexuality in any of the curriculums in any of my classes. The Yes on Prop 8 Coalition played a disgusting, dirty political game with those campaigns. And who the fuck cares if your child happens to see a gay couple in public. Do you think by not letting them marry that it's going to stop them from being gay? Sexual orientation is NOT something that has social control; you can't STOP someone from being gay or straight any more than you can stop them from being black or white, or male or female. The fact that people want to viciously tear away anybody's rights is just wrong. I thought this country was headed in a more progressive direction, but the passing of Prop 8 is making me think twice about that. Especially when I consider that had I been alive over 40 years ago, I wouldn't have been able to marry my Jewish-Mexican boyfriend without a Supreme Court battle.
It's just so wrong
xxManBeaterxx
Well-known member
Quote:
Nope previous cali marriages all though still did not have all the rights as a married straight couple they still had some... Well previous gay marriages... they will now be discredited and invaild...
| Originally Posted by mizuki~
I was pretty pissed when my DH broke the news to me this morning. I really didn't think this would pass.... I hope at least the previous gay marriages stay legit. Ugh..this is so ridiculous 
|
Nope previous cali marriages all though still did not have all the rights as a married straight couple they still had some... Well previous gay marriages... they will now be discredited and invaild...
carandru
Well-known member
Yea, I totally agree. I don't see how this is any different than not allowing interracial marriages.
And I guess my issue is that this should not be on the ballot in any state at anytime. If you grants these rights to person A, you have to give the same rights to person B. If you don't want person B to have those rights, then take them away from person A. Haha, could you imagine how these people would feel if the right to marry was taken away from everyone? Yea, I don't think they would like that... yet, they impose this on other people
And I guess my issue is that this should not be on the ballot in any state at anytime. If you grants these rights to person A, you have to give the same rights to person B. If you don't want person B to have those rights, then take them away from person A. Haha, could you imagine how these people would feel if the right to marry was taken away from everyone? Yea, I don't think they would like that... yet, they impose this on other people
MzzRach
Well-known member
Quote:
A good friend of mine just married his partner last Thursday. I certainly hope their union is not "voided" by this amendment to California's constitution.
I have a "wait and see" attitude about this at the moment.
| Originally Posted by TISH1127
California's attorney general, Jerry Brown, has said he believes that the marriages will remain valid, but Geoff Kors, the executive director of Equality California, a gay rights group that opposes Proposition 8, said he expected challenges. They said over the past 5 days they performed the highest rate of marriages in their history. |
A good friend of mine just married his partner last Thursday. I certainly hope their union is not "voided" by this amendment to California's constitution.
I have a "wait and see" attitude about this at the moment.
xxManBeaterxx
Well-known member
Quote:
I think they can, but once they go back to california its invaild... unless they decide to live in the state they got married at.
| Originally Posted by vocaltest
this is awful. this might be a dumb question, but could gay/lesbian couples from california be able to go to another state & get married?? |
I think they can, but once they go back to california its invaild... unless they decide to live in the state they got married at.
