California - Prop 8 - PASSED

[TISH1124]

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxManBeaterxx I think they can, but once they go back to california is invaild... unless they decide to live in the state they got married at.

I would say yes...Because they said they had people from all over the world coming to Cali just to get married ... You should be able to get married anywhere that permits same sex marriage at least I would think...
Heterosexuals can marry anywhere...so there should be no difference IMO

 

[silverbelle282]

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Originally Posted by MzzRach A good friend of mine just married his partner last Thursday. I certainly hope their union is not "voided" by this amendment to California's constitution. I have a "wait and see" attitude about this at the moment.

me too, man. i haven't had time today to research it in depth, like i like to do, but my gut feeling is we're going to have to wait and see where all the states fall, and then it will probably be brought up to the supreme court like the loving case (interracial marriage) was (and had to be) for a definitive answer.

most people move a few times in their lifetime, it's going to be interesting to watch and see how states react to gay married couples moving from states with different gay marriage laws, and all of the accompanying issues which that encompasses (i.e., full faith and credit clause, DOMA, tax incentives for marriage, etc . . .)

just scary to me when i think about the leader of the supremes. it, unfortunately, looks like it's going to be a long, hard road on this issue.

 

[TISH1124]

They just announced on CNN that marriages prior to 11/4 will remain valid...Didn't catch all of it but I did catch that part

 

[SuSana]

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Originally Posted by MAC_Pixie04 I HATE HATE HATE that the side that wanted to ban gay marriage used children in their advertisements.

The commercials were so bad. And misleading. But a lot of people believed them.

 

[silverbelle282]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAC_Pixie04 This issue infuriates me. All they wanna do is fucking get married! What is the big goddamn deal?? And I'm sick to death of the rationalizations people come up with for agreeing with overturning it. "Let's protect the sanctity of marriage," "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve," blah blah blah. How's this for protecting the sanctity of marriage: 1. Those heterosexual blabbermouths cheating on their spouses and having affairs behind theirlovers backs; how could they forget that that's one of the 10 commandments, since they wanna lean so hard on the bible. 2. How about all those quickie Vegas weddings that end in annulments three days later? Oh yes, marriage is so sacred that Britney Spears can have one that lasts 55 hours long "just to see how it felt." 3. Open marriages are a lot more common than you think; why get married to someone and take those vows and promises of exclusive love if you'll give the okay for each other to go out and fuck other people? 4. Our divorce rate is so high it sickens me; and that hardly includes homosexual couples because only one or two states allow them to marry in the first place, let alone get divorced. 5. Have you checked craigslist lately? Military men and women actively seek no strings attached partners to agree to fake a marriage in order to collect extra money and benefits for being a married couple. They get married on paper, but lead their lives otherwise normally except for in front of their other military buddies and colleagues so that they don't get caught. What a celebration of traditional marriage. 6. The out-of-wedlock baby boom! It's fantastic; I don't knock people for having babies out of wedlock, I don't give a shit what you do. But don't be so self-righteous that you wanna deny homosexual couples the right to marry and adopt children who need homes while you run around and breed like there's no tomorrow without even half a thought about marriage. There IS no more sanctity left in marriage, in my opinion, especially when there are people who would go out of their way to paint their entire van, house and front yard and even parade their children in support of this Prop 8 nonsense, which is not just an issue of gay rights vs straight rights. It's fucking HUMAN rights. All they want to do is get married and receive the same rights as every other married couple...and get this? IT'S A FAIR SHOT THAT THEY ARE ACTUALLY SERIOUS ABOUT IT! What a concept...a group that wants to get married for the real reasons of getting married, and we don't wanna let them. Land of the free my ass. I'm done being angry now

YOU ARE HILARIOUS!!!! I LOVE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

that's all i wanted to say, oh, and i agree.

 

[silverbelle282]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuSana The commercials were so bad. And misleading. But a lot of people believed them.

meanwhile, plenty of homosexual couples have biological children, and adopt children.

 

[*Stargazer*]

I'm bothered by this so much.

I am terrified of the idea of outlawing something based on one religion's belief that something is wrong. Where does that stop? Isn't it sinful for me to not believe in God? Or be of a different religion?

If I had ever, once heard a non-religious argument against gay marriage, I think I'd have died from shock.

I wish people would keep their religion to themselves and leave the rest of us to do what we please when it doesn't harm anyone else.

 

[TISH1124]

That was my main reason for saying in the Presidential Thread that I don't feel Religion should have any place or play any part in Government Issues

 

[Dice1233]

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Originally Posted by MAC_Pixie04 not just an issue of gay rights vs straight rights. It's fucking HUMAN rights.

This is exactly how I feel. I live in Florida and was holding my breath last night hoping that our similar prop wouldn't get the 60% it needed to pass. But, there it was, it passed. I am so disappointed that people feel so strongly that their (mostly) religious beliefs should be applied to everyone else. Everyone deserves the right to be happy and married, and receive the insurance, tax, and other benefits that come with being married. UG. I just don't understand.

 

[Dice1233]

Ug, just read this as well:

"And in Arkansas, gays and lesbians suffered another defeat, as a proposed ban on unmarried couples adopting or providing foster care for children passed with 57 percent voter approval."

~apparently a child with no home is better than being in the same household as a gay/lesbian couple. Tell me that is not discrimination! Unbelievable.

 

[*Stargazer*]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dice1233 Ug, just read this as well: "And in Arkansas, gays and lesbians suffered another defeat, as a proposed ban on unmarried couples adopting or providing foster care for children passed with 57 percent voter approval." ~apparently a child with no home is better than being in the same household as a gay/lesbian couple. Tell me that is not discrimination! Unbelievable.

Well, no, because you see, all of the people who voted for that must surely have become licensed foster parents or adopted children or are in the process right now. To do otherwise would only be hypocritical of them...

 

[MAC_Pixie04]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TISH1127 I would say yes...Because they said they had people from all over the world coming to Cali just to get married ... You should be able to get married anywhere that permits same sex marriage at least I would think... Heterosexuals can marry anywhere...so there should be no difference IMO

Well people were coming to CA to get married because it was made legal and there was a stipulation that gay marriages from other states would be recognized; now that Prop 8 has passed, that may not be true. I'm glad that marriages that occured before Prop 8 will still be made legal, but I know that this fight isn't over, and I hate that one group of people has to actually FIGHT this long and this hard just to be treated equal. It's 2008 for christ's sakes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverbelle282 YOU ARE HILARIOUS!!!! I LOVE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that's all i wanted to say, oh, and i agree.

Aw I love you too....but it's a damn shame we won't be able to get married in my home state if we choose to take this love any further lol. Can you tell how much this issue fucks my shit up? I typically don't get this heated in regards to politics, I have a live and let live, laidback way of being. But this shit is getting ugly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Stargazer* I'm bothered by this so much. I am terrified of the idea of outlawing something based on one religion's belief that something is wrong. Where does that stop? Isn't it sinful for me to not believe in God? Or be of a different religion? If I had ever, once heard a non-religious argument against gay marriage, I think I'd have died from shock. I wish people would keep their religion to themselves and leave the rest of us to do what we please when it doesn't harm anyone else.

I actually had to remove myself from a dinner party a few weeks ago because of this. There are a lot of people who bring up all these reasons for being against homosexuality and gay marriage, and then claim that they're not using religious regions but underneath every excuse there's a religious root. What the fuck ever happened to separation of church and state? The two aren't supposed to go hand and hand, and in this case they pulled out all the stops and found ways to not mention the bible, but that's where this whole issue comes from. If the bible hadn't stated that homosexuality was a sin, nobody would give a shit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dice1233 Ug, just read this as well: "And in Arkansas, gays and lesbians suffered another defeat, as a proposed ban on unmarried couples adopting or providing foster care for children passed with 57 percent voter approval." ~apparently a child with no home is better than being in the same household as a gay/lesbian couple. Tell me that is not discrimination! Unbelievable.

Will someone please find me a case where a homosexual adoptive or foster couple abused, neglected or otherwise harmed a child that they were caring for?


K...

Now someone find me a case where a heterosexual adoptive or foster couple abused, neglected, or otherwise harmed a child that they were caring for...(here's a hint: check every other thread in the Deep Thoughts forum...)


If I were a foster child I'd damn sure wish I was in a homosexual parented home, I'd be in great shape and dressed to the nines! Jokes aside, what proof is there that heterosexual couples make better parents of any kind to any children? Someone find me something substantial.

 

[xxManBeaterxx]

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Originally Posted by MAC_Pixie04 Jokes aside, what proof is there that heterosexual couples make better parents of any kind to any children? Someone find me something substantial.

It said all unmarried couples cant adopt right? Straight or Gay. And since gays cant marry in arkansas they are under that rule as well

Im not sure if this was probably mainly aimed towards gays... but it sounds like it was...

 

[MACATTAK]

It seems so many people use religion when convenient! Who cares about having premarital sex, doing drugs, cheating, lying, stealing etc?? I know a lot (I'm sure not all) of "religious" people do these things. Now, whatever decisions you decide to make for your life is fine by me, they are none of my business. The same should apply to EVERYONE!!

 

[*Stargazer*]

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxManBeaterxx It said all unmarried couples cant adopt right? Straight or Gay. And since gays cant marry in arkansas they are under that rule as well Im not sure if this was probably mainly aimed towards gays... but it sounds like it was...

It was. The supporters were very vocal about the purpose of it.

 

[silverbelle282]

"Aw I love you too....but it's a damn shame we won't be able to get married in my home state if we choose to take this love any further lol. Can you tell how much this issue fucks my shit up? I typically don't get this heated in regards to politics, I have a live and let live, laidback way of being. But this shit is getting ugly."

too bad i don't have a penis and a couple of tickets to vegas, right?

i'm an attorney working in family law right now which is DEPRESSING as hell. have come across a lot of messed up stuff, and none of it has been because two people in love who happened to be gay decided to raise a family, BELIEVE me, and I have seen some jerry springer crap.

it's BS. but it's awesome that there are people like you and other posters here who are vocal about change, and resist the stifling status quo of protecting "sanctity" and other religion-based arguments.

if marriage were in fact a sacred institution, then perhaps entry into it would be based on other criteria than what genitalia you have (i.e., if you can go out in public and always remember to cover your hooha, then you can get married-- ok ok. i'm kidding. i'm happy brit is making a comeback).

hmm, actually that would be an interesting thread to start. what does everyone think the criteria for obtaining a marriage license should be?

it 'fucks my shit up' too. (i'm totally stealing that lol)

 

[*Stargazer*]

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Originally Posted by silverbelle282 what does everyone think the criteria for obtaining a marriage license should be?

Two, or more, consenting 18+ year old humans.


That's right, I support polygamy. I'm kooky like that.

 

[MAC_Pixie04]

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxManBeaterxx It said all unmarried couples cant adopt right? Straight or Gay. And since gays cant marry in arkansas they are under that rule as well Im not sure if this was probably mainly aimed towards gays... but it sounds like it was...

It was specific to gays; I'm not sure about the regulations as far as unmarried parents...I don't think disallowing unmarried parents to adopt can legally be a law, but it can become an adopted regulation in adoption agencies. I guess it would depend on a lot of other things such as a background check, home life, income etc. I actually have several single mothers in my family who have successfully adopted/fostered children. It generally requires a lot more in depth digging into their lives and it takes longer than when qualified married couples try to adopt.

 

[MAC_Pixie04]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverbelle282 "Aw I love you too....but it's a damn shame we won't be able to get married in my home state if we choose to take this love any further lol. Can you tell how much this issue fucks my shit up? I typically don't get this heated in regards to politics, I have a live and let live, laidback way of being. But this shit is getting ugly." too bad i don't have a penis and a couple of tickets to vegas, right? i'm an attorney working in family law right now which is DEPRESSING as hell. have come across a lot of messed up stuff, and none of it has been because two people in love who happened to be gay decided to raise a family, BELIEVE me, and I have seen some jerry springer crap. it's BS. but it's awesome that there are people like you and other posters here who are vocal about change, and resist the stifling status quo of protecting "sanctity" and other religion-based arguments. if marriage were in fact a sacred institution, then perhaps entry into it would be based on other criteria than what genitalia you have (i.e., if you can go out in public and always remember to cover your hooha, then you can get married-- ok ok. i'm kidding. i'm happy brit is making a comeback). hmm, actually that would be an interesting thread to start. what does everyone think the criteria for obtaining a marriage license should be? it 'fucks my shit up' too. (i'm totally stealing that lol)

The criteria for marriage should be two consenting adults, plain and simple. I don't care if you're black, white, yellow, brown, red or seafoam green. I don't care if you're gay, straight, transexual, drag queen or king, or how you live your life. If you love someone and can commit to what comes along with marriage, then I support you, case closed.

 

[*Stargazer*]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAC_Pixie04 It was specific to gays; I'm not sure about the regulations as far as unmarried parents...I don't think disallowing unmarried parents to adopt can legally be a law, but it can become an adopted regulation in adoption agencies. I guess it would depend on a lot of other things such as a background check, home life, income etc. I actually have several single mothers in my family who have successfully adopted/fostered children. It generally requires a lot more in depth digging into their lives and it takes longer than when qualified married couples try to adopt.

The initiative bans unmarried couples, both heterosexual and homosexual, from fostering or adopting children. The group that proposed the law, some jerks who claim to be all about family, very specifically went out of the way to make sure people knew it was really about gays, though.

Single people were not a target of the initiative.