I Can't Believe Israel Bombed Gaza
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Shoegal-fr
Well-known member
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Well, Israel is NOTHING without the US support...
PLUS, Israel is completely unafraid to use military force ONLY against countries that don't have the nuclear bomb !!
Originally Posted by Shimmer
Israel is completely unafraid to use military force, and to use it on civilians. Are you guys really saying that we want to be at discord with them whilst our military is sprawled across the planet? |
Well, Israel is NOTHING without the US support...
PLUS, Israel is completely unafraid to use military force ONLY against countries that don't have the nuclear bomb !!
Shimmer
Well-known member
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I don't know that I completely agree.
Israel wouldn't be bound by our hesitation to cause civilian casualties. They have more stomach for loss and casualty than Americans do.
| Originally Posted by Shoegal-fr
Well, Israel is NOTHING without the US support... PLUS, Israel is completely unafraid to use military force ONLY against countries that don't have the nuclear bomb !! |
I don't know that I completely agree.
Israel wouldn't be bound by our hesitation to cause civilian casualties. They have more stomach for loss and casualty than Americans do.
Shoegal-fr
Well-known member
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Oh no, they wouldn't be bound, that's sure but, it would be quite stupid if they go on without their only support... i mean they'll probably end without any army or weapons left at one point... They're not that powerful on their own...
And if the USA do discord with Israel for once, it should definitely restore their image...
| Originally Posted by Shimmer
I don't know that I completely agree. Israel wouldn't be bound by our hesitation to cause civilian casualties. They have more stomach for loss and casualty than Americans do. |
Oh no, they wouldn't be bound, that's sure but, it would be quite stupid if they go on without their only support... i mean they'll probably end without any army or weapons left at one point... They're not that powerful on their own...
And if the USA do discord with Israel for once, it should definitely restore their image...
ShugAvery2001
Well-known member
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Didn't we target the Saddam Hussein regime for using military force against civilians
sorry, thought that was illegal
anyways .. there are many Israeli's who are against this as well.... Nobody has a problem with "self defense" this is aggression though
| Originally Posted by Shimmer
Israel is completely unafraid to use military force, and to use it on civilians. |
Didn't we target the Saddam Hussein regime for using military force against civilians
sorry, thought that was illegal
anyways .. there are many Israeli's who are against this as well.... Nobody has a problem with "self defense" this is aggression though
Shimmer
Well-known member
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So the continual rocket fire into Israeli territory doesn't count as aggression on Hamas' behalf?
| Originally Posted by ShugAvery2001
Didn't we target the Saddam Hussein regime for using military force against civilians
sorry, thought that was illegal
anyways .. there are many Israeli's who are against this as well.... Nobody has a problem with "self defense" this is aggression though |
So the continual rocket fire into Israeli territory doesn't count as aggression on Hamas' behalf?
Shoegal-fr
Well-known member
Awww come on, i've just heard that Israel's calling over 6000 reservists, that is just so disproportionate!!
I'm just freaking out, 90% of my extended family live in Egypt, this violence might just spread around...
I'm just freaking out, 90% of my extended family live in Egypt, this violence might just spread around...
Shoegal-fr
Well-known member
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Oh yes, it definitely counts, but the point is the disproportion of the response.
Here:
15 dead due to Hamas rockets these past 8 years
Nearly 400 dead these past 48 hours due to Israel's bombing...
These facts speak for themselves...
| Originally Posted by Shimmer
So the continual rocket fire into Israeli territory doesn't count as aggression on Hamas' behalf? |
Oh yes, it definitely counts, but the point is the disproportion of the response.
Here:
15 dead due to Hamas rockets these past 8 years
Nearly 400 dead these past 48 hours due to Israel's bombing...
These facts speak for themselves...
*Stargazer*
Well-known member
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One of the root causes of this violence is the Israeli funding of illegal settlements. Israel is in direct violation of numerous UN resolutions and doesn't care. Not only do they turn a blind eye to these settlements, but they FUND them.
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Absolutely correct. I saw some numbers once on the amount of money the US gov't sends Israel annually. It blew my mind. We are basically helping fund these illegal settlements and then when Israel responds disproportionately, we tell Hamas to knock it off.
I'm of the firm belief that BOTH parties are in the wrong here and unfortunately, only innocent people suffer.
Israel absolutely has the right to defend itself. One could make the argument that is exactly what Hamas is attempting to do, as well. There is a large faction of violent Israelis that use violence to take land for themselves.
| Originally Posted by Shimmer
But if Hamas had an interest in protecting those people wouldn't they cease the rocket fire instead of increasing it? I'm not saying Isreal's right, I'm just asking. |
One of the root causes of this violence is the Israeli funding of illegal settlements. Israel is in direct violation of numerous UN resolutions and doesn't care. Not only do they turn a blind eye to these settlements, but they FUND them.
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| Originally Posted by concertina
Its not about policing the world; its about us utterly supporting Israel in everything they do. We are the only ones that reign Israel in; we're the only one's they'll even consider listening to when it comes to Palestine. So when we fail to respond to an Israeli assault, that is pretty much us saying 'yep, okay by us!' In my opinion, thats what that quote is about. |
Absolutely correct. I saw some numbers once on the amount of money the US gov't sends Israel annually. It blew my mind. We are basically helping fund these illegal settlements and then when Israel responds disproportionately, we tell Hamas to knock it off.
I'm of the firm belief that BOTH parties are in the wrong here and unfortunately, only innocent people suffer.
Israel absolutely has the right to defend itself. One could make the argument that is exactly what Hamas is attempting to do, as well. There is a large faction of violent Israelis that use violence to take land for themselves.
kimmy
Well-known member
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it's a natural occurrence. if an animal feels threatened, it attacks with intent to kill even if the provocation didn't necessarily warrant such a strong response.
israel is puffing its chest, the way anything threatened would do. hamas will not be diplomatic, so israel is trying to get its message across another way: violence.
it's called collateral damage, and it's how wars are won. it's not pretty, but war never is...
| Originally Posted by Shoegal-fr
Oh yes, it definitely counts, but the point is the disproportion of the response. Here: 15 dead due to Hamas rockets these past 8 years Nearly 400 dead these past 48 hours due to Israel's bombing... These facts speak for themselves... |
it's a natural occurrence. if an animal feels threatened, it attacks with intent to kill even if the provocation didn't necessarily warrant such a strong response.
israel is puffing its chest, the way anything threatened would do. hamas will not be diplomatic, so israel is trying to get its message across another way: violence.
it's called collateral damage, and it's how wars are won. it's not pretty, but war never is...
florabundance
Well-known member
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fair enough. but bombing, deliberately, at the time that children are leaving school is not defence..it's just making a point. in the most sick and inexcusable way possible.
| Originally Posted by kimmy
it's a natural occurrence. if an animal feels threatened, it attacks with intent to kill even if the provocation didn't necessarily warrant such a strong response. israel is puffing its chest, the way anything threatened would do. hamas will not be diplomatic, so israel is trying to get its message across another way: violence. it's called collateral damage, and it's how wars are won. it's not pretty, but war never is... |
fair enough. but bombing, deliberately, at the time that children are leaving school is not defence..it's just making a point. in the most sick and inexcusable way possible.
DirtyPlum
Well-known member
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I dont buy the human-like-animal BS argument, Ive read it somewhere else too. You cant compare two 'countries' as tho they are like tiger vs. wilderbeast or whatever, and how much one puffs its chest.
IMO there is a difference between humans and animals is that we have more complex minds and have the ability and choice of whether to attack so aggresively or not. This is not about about killer instinct, its about human life and the right to peace and civilisation.
This crisis goes a lot deeper than the recent bombings and there are far more issues surrounding it - I dont think it can be discussed as so black and white without the full backround or context. I strongly urge those interested enought to post, to actually read up on the Crisis and its history.
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no shit?!?
I guess with thoughts like that, its no wonder wars start and/or continue...
| Originally Posted by kimmy
it's a natural occurrence. if an animal feels threatened, it attacks with intent to kill even if the provocation didn't necessarily warrant such a strong response. israel is puffing its chest, the way anything threatened would do. hamas will not be diplomatic, so israel is trying to get its message across another way: violence. it's called collateral damage, and it's how wars are won. it's not pretty, but war never is... |
I dont buy the human-like-animal BS argument, Ive read it somewhere else too. You cant compare two 'countries' as tho they are like tiger vs. wilderbeast or whatever, and how much one puffs its chest.
IMO there is a difference between humans and animals is that we have more complex minds and have the ability and choice of whether to attack so aggresively or not. This is not about about killer instinct, its about human life and the right to peace and civilisation.
This crisis goes a lot deeper than the recent bombings and there are far more issues surrounding it - I dont think it can be discussed as so black and white without the full backround or context. I strongly urge those interested enought to post, to actually read up on the Crisis and its history.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by kimmy
it's called collateral damage, and it's how wars are won. it's not pretty, but war never is... |
no shit?!?
I guess with thoughts like that, its no wonder wars start and/or continue...
kimmy
Well-known member
Quote:
collateral damage is a real thing, and it's been part of war as long as wars have been being fought. it's not a thought, it's reality. i'm not saying it's right, i'm not saying that israel is totally in the right here, i'm just calling it for what it is...
| Originally Posted by DirtyPlum
I guess with thoughts like that, its no wonder wars start and/or continue... |
collateral damage is a real thing, and it's been part of war as long as wars have been being fought. it's not a thought, it's reality. i'm not saying it's right, i'm not saying that israel is totally in the right here, i'm just calling it for what it is...
Shoegal-fr
Well-known member
Jesus !!! I've just heard the army is entering in Palestine right now... it makes me sick!!
Shoegal-fr
Well-known member
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Sure, but in this case, this is absolutely not collateral damages, it's not like Israel tried to respond legitimately and it just happened that universities, schools, hospitals were attacked.... They actually meant to do that, to attack people and places that have nothing to do with Hamas attacks, and all that despite the United nations have condamned it, they keep on going!!
Israel is bombing under the pretext of fighting terrorism, but that is just lies, they are terrorists themselves.
I can understand that they may have to defend themselves, but what's happening now has nothing to do with defense, it's just so hypocrite, and i just can't stand that no country has lifted a finger.
That is just scandalous and disgusting.
| Originally Posted by kimmy
collateral damage is a real thing, and it's been part of war as long as wars have been being fought. it's not a thought, it's reality. i'm not saying it's right, i'm not saying that israel is totally in the right here, i'm just calling it for what it is... |
Sure, but in this case, this is absolutely not collateral damages, it's not like Israel tried to respond legitimately and it just happened that universities, schools, hospitals were attacked.... They actually meant to do that, to attack people and places that have nothing to do with Hamas attacks, and all that despite the United nations have condamned it, they keep on going!!
Israel is bombing under the pretext of fighting terrorism, but that is just lies, they are terrorists themselves.
I can understand that they may have to defend themselves, but what's happening now has nothing to do with defense, it's just so hypocrite, and i just can't stand that no country has lifted a finger.
That is just scandalous and disgusting.
nunu
Well-known member
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I totally agree! I mean the palestinian civilians are actually fighting with rocks what are the israelli military fighting back with? Bombs and Guns..Oh yeah they are defending themselves against tiny pieces of rocks.
5 defenceless sisters ranged from the age of 4-16 were killed because the Israelli army bombed their house. Ofcourse the numbers keep gettng bigger and Israiel doesn't want to budge and still insists on killing innocent civilians.
| Originally Posted by Shoegal-fr
Sure, but in this case, this is absolutely not collateral damages, it's not like Israel tried to respond legitimately and it just happened that universities, schools, hospitals were attacked.... They actually meant to do that, to attack people and places that have nothing to do with Hamas attacks, and all that despite the Union nations have condamned it, they keep on going!! Israel is bombing under the pretext of fighting terrorism, but that is just lies, they are terrorists themselves. I can understand that they may have to defend themselves, but what's happening now has nothing to do with defense, it's just so hypocrite, and i just can't stand that no country has lifted a finger. That is just scandalous and disgusting. |
I totally agree! I mean the palestinian civilians are actually fighting with rocks what are the israelli military fighting back with? Bombs and Guns..Oh yeah they are defending themselves against tiny pieces of rocks.
5 defenceless sisters ranged from the age of 4-16 were killed because the Israelli army bombed their house. Ofcourse the numbers keep gettng bigger and Israiel doesn't want to budge and still insists on killing innocent civilians.
Shadowy Lady
Well-known member
This issue makes me so sad. I don't think the leaders on either side want peace, unfortunately their ppl have suffered and will continue to suffer. This issue is now so old and deep that I don't believe it will be resolved in our lifetime.
Shoegal-fr
Well-known member
Quote:
No, no, no, i refuse to lose faith.
See what happened with the conflict in Ireland, it has improved a lot...
We have to believe it'll happen at some point!
| Originally Posted by Shadowy Lady
This issue makes me so sad. I don't think the leaders on either side want peace, unfortunately their ppl have suffered and will continue to suffer. This issue is now so old and deep that I don't believe it will be resolved in our lifetime. |
No, no, no, i refuse to lose faith.
See what happened with the conflict in Ireland, it has improved a lot...
We have to believe it'll happen at some point!
Lapis
Well-known member
Quote:
The UN has over a HUNDRED resolutions against Israel!!! The US blocks every.single.one!!!!
List of United Nations resolutions concerning Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Yup until the US stops giving Israel billions in aid each year (yeah 3 billion a year people) which mostly goes to the military there they won't listen to the UN, I was reading some Jewish writers years ago who were against establishing Israel in the location where is it because it would have been a military state etc, every warning these men gave have now come thru
America needs to stop being soo invested in other country's, the enemy of my enemy is my friend is no longer the way to go, look at Afganistan, America does not profit from this method of thinking.
| Originally Posted by Beauty Mark
I think if the Us were truly interested in staying out this, they'd refrain from commenting. I also think placing sanctions and embargoes are a means of policing. Besides the sheer awfulness of what's happening, given that weapons can reach far in the world, we should care what's going on. I don't know how it could involve the US being attacked, but stranger things have happened |
The UN has over a HUNDRED resolutions against Israel!!! The US blocks every.single.one!!!!
List of United Nations resolutions concerning Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Quote:
| Originally Posted by *Stargazer*
One of the root causes of this violence is the Israeli funding of illegal settlements. Israel is in direct violation of numerous UN resolutions and doesn't care. Not only do they turn a blind eye to these settlements, but they FUND them. Absolutely correct. I saw some numbers once on the amount of money the US gov't sends Israel annually. It blew my mind. We are basically helping fund these illegal settlements and then when Israel responds disproportionately, we tell Hamas to knock it off. I'm of the firm belief that BOTH parties are in the wrong here and unfortunately, only innocent people suffer. Israel absolutely has the right to defend itself. One could make the argument that is exactly what Hamas is attempting to do, as well. There is a large faction of violent Israelis that use violence to take land for themselves. |
Yup until the US stops giving Israel billions in aid each year (yeah 3 billion a year people) which mostly goes to the military there they won't listen to the UN, I was reading some Jewish writers years ago who were against establishing Israel in the location where is it because it would have been a military state etc, every warning these men gave have now come thru
America needs to stop being soo invested in other country's, the enemy of my enemy is my friend is no longer the way to go, look at Afganistan, America does not profit from this method of thinking.
