Talk to me.

[TISH1124]

^I understand what you are saying...However there are a lot of simple questions that are asked that does not require a MA to answer....that people get upset about....They are not directed just at a MA but at anyone who knows the answer....For instance....When is this collection launching? That is not necessarily a question that a MA has to answer ....nor is it directed just at a MA but a question in general that people are getting lashed out for asking....I totally understand that it gets frustrating answering the same questions over and over...If you have answered it and don't want to again...Don't...let someone else who deosn't mind (which is the most of us) answer it so that person gets the info they need. It is not necessary that people read 150 pages of a thread if they do not have the time or the notion to...half the time we do not just talk about collections anyway we talk about everything...a lot of people don't care to read all of that and they shouldn't have to just because one person or others do.

But a lead page to collections would be nice....stating everything about the products...overview etc...But be available to many MA's that we love and respect the opinions of

 

[aziajs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nunu I agree with you on the first part. I myself have been recently scared to ask questions in colour collection threads because i know someone is going to bite my head off. I've seen it happen to a few memebers and i felt bad for them. It never used to be like this before. Now, one would reply rudely by saying "i've answered this a few pages back and won't answer again". Well since you replied then you might as well just answer or just ignore it and let someone else answer. Also, i dread going to collection threads since sometimes the thread explodes over off topic convo's and you have like 8 pages over night. I try to read what i can since i don't want to miss out on any poissible dupes or a way of using a new product etc... About the FOTD part, some people don't like to see and CC, even if they do ask for it and that's why I mostly refrain from it.

I agree on all 3 counts. I had noticed about a year or two ago that the tone changed and there was just a lot of aggression and little patience. It just seems to escalate very quickly. It was weird to see things go from being so mellow and inviting to seeing people be so rude. Lately, I can't say that I've seen it as much because I'm not on as much. Now you only see 4 pages when you click on "new posts" so once I skim that I am done. But, this was a major issue I had at one time because it doesn't make sense to bite people's heads off. I, personally, rarely read discussion threads because I don't have the time or the patience to scroll through 102 pages of comments. The information is too easily buried within the discussions. Then if you ask a question people get an attitude. It's nonsense. But the discussion thread isn't the only place where I have seen people snapped at like that.

As for the FOTDs, you do have to ask for CC. Simple as that. I think you get what you ask for. I will say that there are a lot of people who don't know how to give constructive criticism. They can criticize but there isn't anything constructive about it. So, to that point I'm glad people tend to keep their opinions to themselves.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TISH1124 But a lead page to collections would be nice....stating everything about the products...overview etc...But be available to many MA's that we love and respect the opinions of

I was thinking the same thing about the lead page. Some kind of page that could highlight some of the important things about a collection or address FAQs about a collection. I just don't know how possible it would be to create such a page and who would update it.

The problem with creating a forum where MAs can review and evaluate is that you don't know who is a MA. Yes, we know Erine, Ruby Woo, IIErinII (I think that's her name) and some others but there are a lot of others on here and you don't want to exclude people. You also don't want everybody and their mama reviewing and commenting. I could also see that area getting very clique-y.

 

[RedRibbon]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TISH1124 But a lead page to collections would be nice....stating everything about the products...overview etc...But be available to many MA's that we love and respect the opinions of

I was going to suggest this, a page which stated which products were going to be released, possible swatches if MAC do pre-releases, date of release in differing countries. Or maybe the admin can just edit teh first post with this information as it comes out so that people don't have to trawl through a whole thread to find stuff out and those who get annoyed at having to ask questions over and over again won't do so.

 

[TISH1124]

Yeah like a Most Commonly asked question page about the collection
Ex:Style Black
Launch Dates:
Does the Greasepaint Sticks compare to shade sticks
Are they eye safe
Glimmerglass, e/s, l/s, etc : Are there close dupes in the perm line
etc etc

 

[RedRibbon]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TISH1124 Yeah like a Most Commonly asked question page about the collection Ex:Style Black Launch Dates: Does the Greasepaint Sticks compare to shade sticks Are they eye safe Glimmerglass, e/s, l/s, etc : Are there close dupes in the perm line etc etc

Yep, that kinda thing would be perfect.

The dupes in the perm line would be excellent!

 

[aziajs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TISH1124 Yeah like a Most Commonly asked question page about the collection Ex:Style Black Launch Dates: Does the Greasepaint Sticks compare to shade sticks Are they eye safe Glimmerglass, e/s, l/s, etc : Are there close dupes in the perm line etc etc

Exactly. You just need someone who keeps up with the threads to update that area. Just throwing it out there but if Susanne, who is already an advisor, is active in the discussion thread and reads all of the comments already perhaps this is something she and Janice can discuss making a reality.

 

[nunu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRibbon The dupes in the perm line would be excellent!

That's an excellent idea.
I think this could be done on the first post of the colour collection thread.

 

[MzzRach]

I totally agree with doing something like an FAQs for the colour collection threads. Not that I mind when questions are repeated in these threads, since frankly I (and I am sure many others) are not able to read every single page/post of the super fast/busy colour threads.

An FAQ "quick hit" companion thread/sticky, if this was able to be implemented, would be very helpful for all I think. Both for those who provide the information (so they do not have to repeat themselves) and for those who want "at a glance" collection info.

Thanks for starting this thread and facilitating this dialogue, Janice.

 

[RedRibbon]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nunu That's an excellent idea. I think this could be done on the first post of the colour collection thread.

I can't take credit for that as Tish would whoop my behind

but it is a great idea.

I agree with the idea of having the mod who "does" that section being in charge of amending the first page of the thread. I also think it should say that all ACCURATE information is contained in the first post and the first post only as there can be a lot of misinformation on here (not maliciously or anything) but people hear things from others incorrectly and the threads end up with one correct answer and about five incorrect ones.

 

[Shimmer]

I *know* I haven't been as active within the forums, and as a moderator, I should be.
I'm sorry people feel the site is more rude than ever before, I hope we can fix that.

 

[panda0410]

^^I dont just think its activity, though I havent noticed a huge shift in tone from general members, advisors or most of the mods for that matter. Time away from forums is just as important as time on them IMHO, and to be perfectly honest - we all have lives that would see us NOT on here every day and thats both perfectly normal and probably also necessary. I dont think you should be apologising Jamie for not always being here, thats part of the the point of having more than one moderator, so that you can swing away when you need to, forum burnout happens!!

As far as rudeness goes, well Ok... so I have my head covered here and I'm ready to dodge the bricks...LOL... but seriously when I say this I mean it - I havent noticed so much rudeness coming from everyday members - that suprised me a little I guess, but I dont trawl the collection threads at length either where prob most of the discussion takes place, and to some extent I also feel like personality clashes and forum burnout are inevitable at times - its just the nature of the beast. But there are a few moderators here who are rude to the point of being downright awful, not just repeatedly, but consistently, and they have been like that since the day I joined - a few years ago now. I have hesitated for some time in being open about this, some of the moderators in particular are rude frequently to members here - and that has never been any different IMHO.

TBH if we are complaining about rudeness from members then perhaps the mods in question need to take note of their own tone in the forum. They set the example and if thats the standard to be set then I CAN say that I'm honestly not surprised if others have seen a swing in general members tone as well.

 

[aziajs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by panda0410 TBH if we are complaining about rudeness from members then perhaps the mods in question need to take note of their own tone in the forum. They set the example and if thats the standard to be set then I CAN say that I'm honestly not surprised if others have seen a swing in general members tone as well.

Very true.

 

[Susanne]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TISH1124 But a lead page to collections would be nice....stating everything about the products...overview etc...But be available to many MA's that we love and respect the opinions of

Quote:

Originally Posted by TISH1124 Yeah like a Most Commonly asked question page about the collection Ex:Style Black Launch Dates: Does the Greasepaint Sticks compare to shade sticks Are they eye safe Glimmerglass, e/s, l/s, etc : Are there close dupes in the perm line etc etc

That is what I have thought!

 

[Susanne]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aziajs Exactly. You just need someone who keeps up with the threads to update that area. Just throwing it out there but if Susanne, who is already an advisor, is active in the discussion thread and reads all of the comments already perhaps this is something she and Janice can discuss making a reality.

I would love to help here!

 

[TISH1124]

Quote:

Originally Posted by panda0410 ^^I dont just think its activity, though I havent noticed a huge shift in tone from general members, advisors or most of the mods for that matter. Time away from forums is just as important as time on them IMHO, and to be perfectly honest - we all have lives that would see us NOT on here every day and thats both perfectly normal and probably also necessary. I dont think you should be apologising Jamie for not always being here, thats part of the the point of having more than one moderator, so that you can swing away when you need to, forum burnout happens!! As far as rudeness goes, well Ok... so I have my head covered here and I'm ready to dodge the bricks...LOL... but seriously when I say this I mean it - I havent noticed so much rudeness coming from everyday members - that suprised me a little I guess, but I dont trawl the collection threads at length either where prob most of the discussion takes place, and to some extent I also feel like personality clashes and forum burnout are inevitable at times - its just the nature of the beast. But there are a few moderators here who are rude to the point of being downright awful, not just repeatedly, but consistently, and they have been like that since the day I joined - a few years ago now. I have hesitated for some time in being open about this, some of the moderators in particular are rude frequently to members here - and that has never been any different IMHO. TBH if we are complaining about rudeness from members then perhaps the mods in question need to take note of their own tone in the forum. They set the example and if thats the standard to be set then I CAN say that I'm honestly not surprised if others have seen a swing in general members tone as well.

 

[shootout]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nichollecaren I've noticed a trend in the FOTD pages also, where people just compliment and hardly offer CC. I understand that its because the CC isnt taken well sometimes. I was saddened by this, because I would love some, but I have learnt not to expect it. Its bad that a few people have changed the tone for some of us that just want to learn.

I try to give CC when I can, but after dealing with some members becoming defensive when I suggest something (even when they ask for CC) I've decided it's just easier to comment on what I like and move on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by panda0410 But there are a few moderators here who are rude to the point of being downright awful, not just repeatedly, but consistently, and they have been like that since the day I joined - a few years ago now. I have hesitated for some time in being open about this, some of the moderators in particular are rude frequently to members here - and that has never been any different IMHO. TBH if we are complaining about rudeness from members then perhaps the mods in question need to take note of their own tone in the forum. They set the example and if thats the standard to be set then I CAN say that I'm honestly not surprised if others have seen a swing in general members tone as well.

AGREED! I have noticed a few mods being extemely rude to members, and often over little things.

 

[Janice]

Before we take the mod issue any further in a public forum, I would like to ask that from this point further you PM me with your concerns about staff. These ladies spend their personal time on the site volunteering their savvy in the areas they moderate. I personally rely heavily on them for those duties as the forum generates an insane amount of content on a daily basis that I have no hope of moderating/administrating alone. Because the moderators see so much of the content I can understand some things might become redundant. Also since they spend so much of their personal time working on the forums there is a genuine investment in the forum of their part. Not making any excuses, but trying to give you a different angle of viewing the situation. I'm totally open to listening to you and sharing it with the staff though, let's just do that one on one.

Susanne, let's the get ball rolling on this color story additional post idea. Send me a PM outlining the format you propose and we will work with you on implementing it.

Thanks everyone for the input, please continue contributing to this thread if you feel you can add something.

 

[panda0410]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janice Before we take the mod issue any further in a public forum, I would like to ask that from this point further you PM me with your concerns about staff. These ladies spend their personal time on the site volunteering their savvy in the areas they moderate. I personally rely heavily on them for those duties as the forum generates an insane amount of content on a daily basis that I have no hope of moderating/administrating alone. Because the moderators see so much of the content I can understand some things might become redundant. Also since they spend so much of their personal time working on the forums there is a genuine investment in the forum of their part. Not making any excuses, but trying to give you a different angle of viewing the situation. I'm totally open to listening to you and sharing it with the staff though, let's just do that one on one. Susanne, let's the get ball rolling on this color story additional post idea. Send me a PM outlining the format you propose and we will work with you on implementing it. Thanks everyone for the input, please continue contributing to this thread if you feel you can add something.

I have PM you.

I want to make a point though that redundancy does not warrant a snap of the tongue... regardless of how many times the issue is raised. Thats part of the job of moderating AFAIC, and if the mod is unable to control that, or deal with those pressures then he/she is best to let someone else deal with it on the day.

Personal investment I understand, and I think that ALL of us appreciate the work the mods put into the forum, there is simply no denying that. But personal investment also does not give any moderator the right to speak to members here the way several of them have done in the past. IMHO if personal investment encompsses that model of behaviour then thats an investment the forum can do without. MHO.

 

[rbella]

Well, I'll be frank. I used to love, love, love it here. Everyday. Now, I don't. I feel that the site has become incredibly "cliquish", which is going to happen, but it annoys me that if you insert your opinion on a topic, you have to wait for the thunderous bitch-slapping of disapproval from groups of people that stick together.

I guess there is no way to change that, it is what it is. But the color threads, in my opinion, are the most bothersome. God forbid should you dislike anything or state an opinion regarding how something didn't suit your needs. If you aren't part of the "clique", forget it. You are up shitcreek and either you are going to be completely ignored with absolutely no productive discussion, or you will have the "all-buy, MAC rocks, nothing sucks" group post about 50 posts on how beautiful it was and you must be crazy because it worked for them. It is annoying and not every person has the money nor the skin-tone to own every single MAC item that has ever launched or existed.

In addition, if you choose to like the most butt-ugly shadow in a product launch, well, it should be your friggin' prerogative. Who cares? It just seems like those threads are so damn univiting. Especially to a new person. I'm an advisor and feel uncomfortable in there.

There are some extremely opinionated people on this board, and the bullying of unpopular posters is getting old. This was a fun, happy place where we could all share our thoughts and excitement. It doesn't feel that way to me anymore.

I'm sorry Janice, I know this is not anything you could prevent, it is simply because of the combination of personalities on the board these days. It feels like high school. I don't know what the answer is, it is a public forum. I guess I just wish that rather than having 5 people who are opinionated and quite abrupt on the boards, we had more people with balls willing to stand up to them.

That's my take on it.

 

[Simply Elegant]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbella Well, I'll be frank. I used to love, love, love it here. Everyday. Now, I don't. I feel that the site has become incredibly "cliquish", which is going to happen, but it annoys me that if you insert your opinion on a topic, you have to wait for the thunderous bitch-slapping of disapproval from groups of people that stick together. I guess there is no way to change that, it is what it is. But the color threads, in my opinion, are the most bothersome. God forbid should you dislike anything or state an opinion regarding how something didn't suit your needs. If you aren't part of the "clique", forget it. You are up shitcreek and either you are going to be completely ignored with absolutely no productive discussion, or you will have the "all-buy, MAC rocks, nothing sucks" group post about 50 posts on how beautiful it was and you must be crazy because it worked for them. It is annoying and not every person has the money nor the skin-tone to own every single MAC item that has ever launched or existed. In addition, if you choose to like the most butt-ugly shadow in a product launch, well, it should be your friggin' prerogative. Who cares? It just seems like those threads are so damn univiting. Especially to a new person. I'm an advisor and feel uncomfortable in there. There are some extremely opinionated people on this board, and the bullying of unpopular posters is getting old. This was a fun, happy place where we could all share our thoughts and excitement. It doesn't feel that way to me anymore. I'm sorry Janice, I know this is not anything you could prevent, it is simply because of the combination of personalities on the board these days. It feels like high school. I don't know what the answer is, it is a public forum. I guess I just wish that rather than having 5 people who are opinionated and quite abrupt on the boards, we had more people with balls willing to stand up to them. That's my take on it.

I wouldn't have said this myself, but I agree.

I also agree that there is some rudeness about repeat questions and although I can see how it would get irritating at times when the answer is a couple of pages back, there's so much unrelated chatter to skim through so it's hard to tell how far back the answer is to your question if it was even asked already.