Pondering Racial Connotations of "Lightful"
- Thread starter Me220
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*Stargazer*
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Unfortunately, they do have the right to hold digusting opinions. What they DON'T have the right to do is commit crimes or prevent others from exercising their rights. I also have the right to label people racist or bigoted or slackjawed yokels or any number of things. But I can't go out and lynch someone because they are a white supremacist, much as I think the country would be better off without them.
Originally Posted by VeronikaJ
People or groups with such RACIST AND RIDICULOUS points of views do not have a right to their opinion. People who commit such acts and hold such beliefs are not human. They're disgusting bodies (they have no merit to be human) who thrive on the suffering and hatred they possess for minority groups. |
Unfortunately, they do have the right to hold digusting opinions. What they DON'T have the right to do is commit crimes or prevent others from exercising their rights. I also have the right to label people racist or bigoted or slackjawed yokels or any number of things. But I can't go out and lynch someone because they are a white supremacist, much as I think the country would be better off without them.
Shimmer
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Agreed wholly.
| Originally Posted by Hawkeye
They are allowed. I'm still trying to figure out how the hell they got in this discussion. I just don't think that them being in this discussion is helping a peaceful form of discussion and only fueling more heated debate. Sort of like throwing gasoline or alcohol on a fire. |
Agreed wholly.
Shimmer
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Double check the Bill of Rights. They certainly do have the right to express their opinion. They do not have the right to commit acts of violence against another person. It's not illegal to hate. It's illegal to act on their hatred. Big difference.
And, btw, minority groups hate just as eloquently and frequently as non minority groups do.
Hate's hate...it doesn't matter who's doing the hating.
| Originally Posted by VeronikaJ
People or groups with such RACIST AND RIDICULOUS points of views do not have a right to their opinion. People who commit such acts and hold such beliefs are not human. They're disgusting bodies (they have no merit to be human) who thrive on the suffering and hatred they possess for minority groups. |
Double check the Bill of Rights. They certainly do have the right to express their opinion. They do not have the right to commit acts of violence against another person. It's not illegal to hate. It's illegal to act on their hatred. Big difference.
And, btw, minority groups hate just as eloquently and frequently as non minority groups do.
Hate's hate...it doesn't matter who's doing the hating.
Shimmer
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I understand and appreciate it's your opinion, but to say that someone can't express their opinion because it's "wrong" goes against the very foundation of what this country was built upon.
| Originally Posted by VeronikaJ
This is my opinion. I opt not to stick up for groups such as these. No more comments. |
I understand and appreciate it's your opinion, but to say that someone can't express their opinion because it's "wrong" goes against the very foundation of what this country was built upon.
Trunkmonkey
Well-known member
Gee wheres John Lennon when you need him..
Imagine
Imagine
honyd
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SEE THIS IS WHY..... KKK?????????? NO ON EVERY MADE METION TO THAT HEIGHT OR RACISIM........
ok standing by..... I WANT NO PART OF THIS. AND OPINIONS ARE GETTING OUT OF WHACK. NO ONE IN MY OPION ON HERE IS DIVIDED!! MY POINT WAS EVERY RACE FEELS DISCRIMATED AT ONE POINT. THANKS
| Originally Posted by ARmakeupjunkie
How funny that you would think that some People of color are the most racist. Last time I checked, we were not the ones wearing white robes and hoods down town, on a Saturday, the day of both university graduations when there are thounsands of people in from all over the country to see their loves one graduate or handing out fliers on your local Wal-Mart parking lot. It's the reason my Dad does not go to Wal-Mart today. But, that's just my opinion. And no, I would not care if there was a WET, White Entertainment Teleivision, because I watch CMT and I love NASCAR. This thread was never about race until a few people added their two cents and tried to make it about race. I believe it's safe to say that now, Specktra is divided and will never be in harmony again. 
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SEE THIS IS WHY..... KKK?????????? NO ON EVERY MADE METION TO THAT HEIGHT OR RACISIM........
ok standing by..... I WANT NO PART OF THIS. AND OPINIONS ARE GETTING OUT OF WHACK. NO ONE IN MY OPION ON HERE IS DIVIDED!! MY POINT WAS EVERY RACE FEELS DISCRIMATED AT ONE POINT. THANKS
aziza
Well-known member
Whew! This thread was a toughie to read. Man. I think its kind of crazy how this all spiraled out of control. Me220 was genuinely interested in discussing an issue that affects us all as women. Its disappointing to see where this ended up. On many issues discussed on Specktra, we agree to disagree and go merrily along our way but whenever race pops up in the convo everyone starts slinging mud. Or rocks. And it hurts. It’s very obvious that some are uncomfortable talking about these sort of topics.
Reading this post some questions came to mind: Are we beating a dead horse? Does it not matter? Does it not involve everyone? Is it even worth discussing? So we can’t talk about race, racial issues, or racism on Specktra.net? Slightly miffed…
Reading this post some questions came to mind: Are we beating a dead horse? Does it not matter? Does it not involve everyone? Is it even worth discussing? So we can’t talk about race, racial issues, or racism on Specktra.net? Slightly miffed…
greatscott2000
Well-known member
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I think that there are other BOC's that aren't them that aren't disussed in mainstream like Gabrielle Union for example.
Angelina and Jessica's lips are fawned by everyone now but if you grew up with those desired atrributes when they weren't so desired- its hurtful because you have been teased for so long and now people have what you got.
As far as the collections go- we have a long way to go before every collection caters to all skintones. So I have and will continue to not pay for collections that don't enhance or fit my skintone- that's the cosmetic companies "bad" and its money I am saving for someone who will cater my needs. But with me, I have actually complained to cosmetics companies in writing and have let them know that they are losing a market of people who are interested, but you have nothing to offer. I can't say they haven't listened- especially when it comes down to how much money we spend on cosmetics.
| Originally Posted by ARmakeupjunkie
I think what Shimmer was saying about Tyra and Beyonce is a great example of why this thread was started. |
I think that there are other BOC's that aren't them that aren't disussed in mainstream like Gabrielle Union for example.
Angelina and Jessica's lips are fawned by everyone now but if you grew up with those desired atrributes when they weren't so desired- its hurtful because you have been teased for so long and now people have what you got.
As far as the collections go- we have a long way to go before every collection caters to all skintones. So I have and will continue to not pay for collections that don't enhance or fit my skintone- that's the cosmetic companies "bad" and its money I am saving for someone who will cater my needs. But with me, I have actually complained to cosmetics companies in writing and have let them know that they are losing a market of people who are interested, but you have nothing to offer. I can't say they haven't listened- especially when it comes down to how much money we spend on cosmetics.
sharyn
Well-known member
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I think that we can still talk about racial issues, racism etc. of course... IMO, the "racism in cosmetic collections" topic is a bit of a dead horse - not the issue of racism or racial issues as a whole.
| Originally Posted by SumtingSweet
Reading this post some questions came to mind: Are we beating a dead horse? Does it not matter? Does it not involve everyone? Is it even worth discussing? So we can’t talk about race, racial issues, or racism on Specktra.net? Slightly miffed…
|
I think that we can still talk about racial issues, racism etc. of course... IMO, the "racism in cosmetic collections" topic is a bit of a dead horse - not the issue of racism or racial issues as a whole.
Hawkeye
Well-known member
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You know I was thinking about that- but at the same time I think that it can get very uncomfortable for some. I mean when we start talking about race inevitably someone is going to get offended and start yelling racist.
There is no way IMHO that you can have a group of ladies start talking about a few racial things without someone getting offended. It's not possible. If a white lady says something about how she feels that a black lady does something wrong then all of the sudden its racist. If a black ladies says something that a white woman does wrong then all of the sudden its reverse racism.
I mean at one point we are all going to have to realize that we can talk about race without it turning into a racism/racial thing.
I mean I would LOVE LOVE to talk about the difference between MLK and Malcom X on here but to do it peacefully can't happen on here.
No matter what it just turns into a huge racial thing because of all the Political Correctness B.S. and all the " oh we want to make sure everyone is included" and no no we cannot ignore some of the racial issues but the moment they raise their head it gets shouted down.
I mean i sincerely perceieved ME220's question as an honest question not to start any off this. But because it had that ugly word- Racial----automatically it turned from the question into a huge thing about racism and then it turned into something that nobody knows what the hell is going on.
*sigh*
| Whew! This thread was a toughie to read. Man. I think its kind of crazy how this all spiraled out of control. Me220 was genuinely interested in discussing an issue that affects us all as women. Its disappointing to see where this ended up. On many issues discussed on Specktra, we agree to disagree and go merrily along our way but whenever race pops up in the convo everyone starts slinging mud. Or rocks. And it hurts. It’s very obvious that some are uncomfortable talking about these sort of topics. Reading this post some questions came to mind: Are we beating a dead horse? Does it not matter? Does it not involve everyone? Is it even worth discussing? So we can’t talk about race, racial issues, or racism on Specktra.net? Slightly miffed… |
You know I was thinking about that- but at the same time I think that it can get very uncomfortable for some. I mean when we start talking about race inevitably someone is going to get offended and start yelling racist.
There is no way IMHO that you can have a group of ladies start talking about a few racial things without someone getting offended. It's not possible. If a white lady says something about how she feels that a black lady does something wrong then all of the sudden its racist. If a black ladies says something that a white woman does wrong then all of the sudden its reverse racism.
I mean at one point we are all going to have to realize that we can talk about race without it turning into a racism/racial thing.
I mean I would LOVE LOVE to talk about the difference between MLK and Malcom X on here but to do it peacefully can't happen on here.
No matter what it just turns into a huge racial thing because of all the Political Correctness B.S. and all the " oh we want to make sure everyone is included" and no no we cannot ignore some of the racial issues but the moment they raise their head it gets shouted down.
I mean i sincerely perceieved ME220's question as an honest question not to start any off this. But because it had that ugly word- Racial----automatically it turned from the question into a huge thing about racism and then it turned into something that nobody knows what the hell is going on.
*sigh*
Raerae
Well-known member
Quote:
I think the bigger issue is, with all the REAL and serious acts of racism out there in the world, is looking for racism in a MU collection really worth the effort?
I think thats what a lot of people are getting at.
| Originally Posted by SumtingSweet
Whew! This thread was a toughie to read. Man. I think its kind of crazy how this all spiraled out of control. Me220 was genuinely interested in discussing an issue that affects us all as women. Its disappointing to see where this ended up. On many issues discussed on Specktra, we agree to disagree and go merrily along our way but whenever race pops up in the convo everyone starts slinging mud. Or rocks. And it hurts. It’s very obvious that some are uncomfortable talking about these sort of topics. Reading this post some questions came to mind: Are we beating a dead horse? Does it not matter? Does it not involve everyone? Is it even worth discussing? So we can’t talk about race, racial issues, or racism on Specktra.net? Slightly miffed…
|
I think the bigger issue is, with all the REAL and serious acts of racism out there in the world, is looking for racism in a MU collection really worth the effort?
I think thats what a lot of people are getting at.
Shimmer
Well-known member
Quote:
RACISM matters, when it's really happening.
Racism, in expecting people of different races to live substandard lives, and in treating people of different races badly, should definitely be talked about.
But the little stuff? The stuff that's (in my eyes at least) inconsequential or not even really racist?
That all detracts from real racism when it happens...kind of like the boy who cries wolf.
| Originally Posted by SumtingSweet
Reading this post some questions came to mind: Are we beating a dead horse? Does it not matter? Does it not involve everyone? Is it even worth discussing? So we can’t talk about race, racial issues, or racism on Specktra.net? Slightly miffed…
|
RACISM matters, when it's really happening.
Racism, in expecting people of different races to live substandard lives, and in treating people of different races badly, should definitely be talked about.
But the little stuff? The stuff that's (in my eyes at least) inconsequential or not even really racist?
That all detracts from real racism when it happens...kind of like the boy who cries wolf.
Raerae
Well-known member
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Yup, thats why I argue that as a society we have lost touch with that racism really is. It loses meaning when everything is called racist.
It loses even more meaning when you have group of people who are "allowed" to dilute racism towards each other, because it's ok, since they are that race. You can empower a word or take it back, whatever, just dont pull a double standard on it when you see other people using it.
| Originally Posted by Shimmer
But the little stuff? The stuff that's (in my eyes at least) inconsequential or not even really racist? That all detracts from real racism when it happens...kind of like the boy who cries wolf. |
Yup, thats why I argue that as a society we have lost touch with that racism really is. It loses meaning when everything is called racist.
It loses even more meaning when you have group of people who are "allowed" to dilute racism towards each other, because it's ok, since they are that race. You can empower a word or take it back, whatever, just dont pull a double standard on it when you see other people using it.
aziza
Well-known member
Quote:
You must've read my mind
. Last semester I took a class on race and racism in America. It was freakin' awesome. Everything was covered. All the PC crap went out the window. In grade school we're told that racism (and evrything race related) disappeared with the Civil Rights Movement. So we don't talk about it and pretend it doesn't exist.
I seriously think that Specktra should have a "No PC allowed" thread started in the Deep Thoughts section. Want to ask a question about Black culture but too afraid to ask? Stick it there and it'll be answered candidly. If you think you can't handle the heat just stay out of that particular kitchen and read along.
| Originally Posted by Hawkeye
No matter what it just turns into a huge racial thing because of all the Political Correctness B.S. and all the " oh we want to make sure everyone is included" and no no we cannot ignore some of the racial issues but the moment they raise their head it gets shouted down. I mean i sincerely perceieved ME220's question as an honest question not to start any off this. But because it had that ugly word- Racial----automatically it turned from the question into a huge thing about racism and then it turned into something that nobody knows what the hell is going on. *sigh* |
You must've read my mind
I seriously think that Specktra should have a "No PC allowed" thread started in the Deep Thoughts section. Want to ask a question about Black culture but too afraid to ask? Stick it there and it'll be answered candidly. If you think you can't handle the heat just stay out of that particular kitchen and read along.
Beauty Mark
Well-known member
I thought Deep Thoughts was supposed to be about discussing issues in a frank manner without worrying about stepping on someone else's toes. Of course, don't be a jerk and write racist/sexist/homophobic/prejudiced things for the hell of it, but if you have a honest question to ask, you shouldn't be afraid to ask it.
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