Talk to me.

[rbella]

I totally see your point. However, it is warm and inviting if you are either, a.) new and have not lurked or b.) are already a member with ties to the other members who have created a bond.

I don't write this as a person who is upset because I "don't belong". I am very aware that for the most part, my opinions have made me "unwanted" in those threads. The page I referenced earlier is a clear indication of that. I write this on behalf of myself as well as many new members and old members alike who have expressed to me a total lack of interest in utilizing those threads because they are not involved in the banter and find reading the threads daunting, time consuming and uninviting. When you are already a part of it and are able to commit a greater amount of time to the conversation, it makes you feel that it is the reason Specktra is such a great community.

What about the thousands of members who have about 1 hour a week to dedicate to this site? They don't come here to "make friends". I think it is fantastic that so many of us have. I don't think the colour collections are the absolute only place to do so. You can still acknowledge your admiration for another member. You can pm them. You can talk to them in a billion different other areas. What is the harm of sending a pm vs clogging up a thread?

In addition, I truly find it hard to believe that the majority of the users here joined the site, initially, because they saw a community filled with happy users who are friends on and off the site. I can't help but think they came here after stumbling upon it regarding the fabulous information it has, the swatches and the resources available to die-hard MAC fans and makeup consumers.

I would feel that it is a sad testament to Specktra to think that if changes were made to make the site user-friendly for a large portion of the community, that it would make a handful of users who are great friends on here want to leave.

Point blank, this is a makeup site. Which has been pointed out to me by the very people who argue there is no "enabling" going on. When one is arguing that people shouldn't feel that any enabling exists and that you should be a responsible consumer and that this is a "MAKEUP SITE, DUH!", then I guess one's stance should remain the same when discussing the colour threads. It is a makeup site. Not a chat room.

 

[capmorlovesmac]

To me Specktra is a makeup website with a lot of informations too but my point of view is different.

To me Specktra is not information only. It is a forum and therewith a community. A forum automatically indicates chatter. If it would be just about information a good move would be to make kind of an makeup wikipedia instead of a forum.
As I said.. informations about MAC and other brands can be found at so many places right now. But this kind of community that Specktra now is.. is unique.

I do disagree that people just join for the information. If you are looking for information only there is no need to register. You can find the information you are looking for in the sticky threads or with the search. What made me join.. I had the chance to get to know a lot of amazing people with participating in the chatter.. was reading the chatter and then joining it. It made me feel welcomed.
A forum is a place with a for a spirit of friendly good-fellowship and I am scared that this could change now here.

 

[MzzRach]

I don't think anyone is proposing that the social aspect of this site be compromised in any way. I have met many wonderful people here and I cherish Specktra for being both a source of amazing information on MAC and other lines, and a community of wonderfully diverse personalities. There is truly no other place like Specktra on the web.

In my opinion, it's a matter of managing the huge volume of content that populates the forums on a daily basis. I think it is worth asking the question - how can things be modified so the the spirit & comraderie of the site is retained, while engaging new members efectively?

I don't think there is an easy answer, but I am glad to see this thread as a place to discuss and explore the options.

 

[hello_kitty]

Quote:

Originally Posted by capmorlovesmac I do disagree that people just join for the information. If you are looking for information only there is no need to register. You can find the information you are looking for in the sticky threads or with the search. What made me join.. I had the chance to get to know a lot of amazing people with participating in the chatter.. was reading the chatter and then joining it. It made me feel welcomed. A forum is a place with a for a spirit of friendly good-fellowship and I am scared that this could change now here.

I'll have to politely disagree with you on this

I honestly almost find it rude to say that if someone just wants information they shouldn't join, and should just search instead. What if they want a question answered? Just because they don't want to talk about what they're eating for dinner, or to become BFFs with someone over the internet doesn't mean they shouldn't feel welcomed to seek information and ask questions in order to get any information or help they seek.

Like I've said, I've run a very large forum before and have seen what certain cliques of e-buddies can do to a reputation of a forum. People have to be aware that there are members of forums that are there not to engage in chatter and make friends, but to learn, get information. They shouldn't feel any less welcomed just because they don't post 50 times a day in a chatter thread and know everyone on a first name basis.

Not looking to argue, just stating my viewpoint. I participate in off topic threads every once in awhile, but I'll admit to everyone I joined for information/help and that's why I'll remain here. I don't actively seek to become a member of the in crowd or to get to know everyone, which is fine and shouldn't be looked down upon. I don't really read color collection threads because it is mostly off topicness and repeat information, so honestly, if they remain how they are I wouldn't care either way. I do sense a riot would brew if they were cracked down upon, though...

 

[Hypathya]

Hi everyone. I've read every post in this thread and I think everybody has important point of view. I have taken time to reflexion before posting, for what is worth I hope is helpful.

Maybe I'm not the most appropriate to give an opinion since I joined Specktra at the end of this august. I don't know how it was 2, 3 years ago, but I have to say i just love the place. I'm here not only for the info, but for the wonderful environment, and the place full of people with one common love: Make up. As former physicist and surrounded with men whose only passion was equations, I've always found myself alone and with no one to share the obsession that has been with me all my life. As far as I can remember, I always felt attracted to color, to people wearing make up and searching ways to make my color pencils show some color in my face.

I deeply enjoy the color collection threads, not only for the information they provide, but the excitement, the rumors about the items on the collection, what the colors would be, how everybody built they wish lists and how, once in the store, some end buying different things form the ones they dreamed of at the beginning and how everybody's life is affected. I think you can't divide your personal life form your passion for the items in the collection. It's the whole thing that makes it wonderful.

I understand that many of us can't have as much time as we'd love to keep track of everything. If you are really in a hurry and you desperately need some specific information, why not google it? Specktra is wonderful, but is not the only resource. Also more often than you think, google will refer you to the specific post that you are searching for (that's how i found Specktra!)

The FAQ section int color collection threads sounds like a good resource to the people in a hurry and will prevent people getting annoying having to answer the same question over and over.

I love the thanks button. I use it every time i think someone's post helped me or gave me a different point of view (even if i don't agree with it). I think it definitely helps to keep track of posts and saves us to read endless "thanks" posts. I love to be able to be polite and thank someone's effort and time. The thanks button makes Spectra so special and different from other places.

As a newbie I can say I have never felt uninvited to join the conversations, to post or even pushed to own every item in a collection. If some people feel otherwise, i don't think is the dynamics of the site that may have caused this. Everybody has fears, insecurities and different backgrounds. I don't mean to hurt anybody with this. I just think we can't blame the community but to understand it. Also, instead of searching for someone to blame, to search within ourselves. Our everyone's personal behavior built the environment of this amazing place. We all users are responsible for the warmth, useful and loving atmosphere.

Another thing I love of Specktra is precisely the diversity of its members. I do love to get to know different personalities, backgrounds, cultures and to get points of view from all of them.

As for the technical problems the site has gone through, what place doesn't has them? Janice, don't push too hard on yourself. You do a terrific job. Give yourself a brake, everything in life happens for a very good reason. Every problem comes with an opportunity.

 

[capmorlovesmac]

I feel like I am repeating myself...But I am just trying to make people understand what I am saying.

I didn't meant that if you are looking for information you shouldn't join. I just meant that there is less need to join. The attraction and the niche Specktra is having in the makeup forum/blog world is the combination of information and chatter.
If there are x blogs/forums all having almost the same information.. what makes people join or follow a specific one? IMO the soft skills is what makes Specktra unique and seeing them maybe being regulated does concern me.

I also made the experience that if you ask a question in the Color Collection thread you will get help. It doesn't matter if you are new to Specktra or already have x posts or x buddies.

 

[Willa]

I don't comment a lot on this thread, althought, I read everything

The chatting part in the CC don't touch me mostly because I don't read this section really except to watch pictures of the upcoming collections.

I do understand how annoying it can be to a person who wants an answer to a question about a collection in particular, because going throught all these pages can be long if ''out of subject'' discussions are going on at the same time. But it doesnt bother me for the reason I stated before.

What bugs me is the whole ''fuss'' around the ''thanks'' function.
We do not use this function for the same reason, you guys named a bunch of them. I do personnaly use it when I share the same opinion, or when it was usefull to me (a swatch per example). I find it sad that some people take this function for a popularity contest

''Ohh... how cool... you were thanked 45 times. You win!''

Can we just chat about our passion?
I really dislike the fact that I have to censure myself from talking about makeup because other people may have an addiction. Personnal fact here : I have an addiction, to food. I know for a fact that I can't go on food/recipes boards and ask people there not to talk about it... they would tell me to get the F-Off... no?

Just saying.

Love you guys <3

 

[Sass]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hello_kitty People get a sense of "entitlement" when they register on forums... like they have a RIGHT to be there, a RIGHT to do whatever they want, demand what they want, etc. How much of it occurs depends on the forum. I ran/owned the largest forum for a particular brand/make of car for 3 years, and people's behavior got so bad that my husband and I pulled the plug on the forum. People would break the rules, and get banned, so they would turn around and post up hate pages slandering me and what not. It got to the point that we felt the cost to our personal lives wasn't worth the extra income... all because people were childish and didn't understand that there are no right guaranteeing someone is allowed to visit a privately owned forum. I'm assuming things are a little better here in specktra, as it's not 20-30 year old boys as the general population, but still... every forum has it's issues. Do I notice cliques here? Yes. Do I notice people automatically supporting popular girls? Yes. Are the color collection threads a mess with chit chat? Yes. Do people seem to like people who buy everything? Yes. But in the end, it's ME that decides to log on here several times a day. No one forces someone to visit a forum. This site is a great resource, and I use it at that. If I feel like it's appropriate to post, I do. There's some things I will not post about on this site because I know it'll go against certain people and cause drama. No biggie, my opinion doesn't have to be heard 100% of the time. I give lots of props to Janice for running a forum of this size, and doing it fairly smoothly! Every web site is going to have technical glitches, and for people to get pissed about it is just uncalled for. I think we all can say we missed the site dearly while it was gone, but I know at least for me, I understood that things can take time to work out and fix. I'd rather wait a week and come back to things operating normal than have spotted access every single day.

Well said, I totally agree. I hope Janice doesn't pull the plug though. If the color threads are the only issues this community has (besides the Clearance Bin eeeeek) then there are really no issues here. Members just need to think about what they are going to post before they post it. Evaluate whether it's a good idea to post said comments...by asking one's self "is what I am about to say will possibly offend someone?" If yes, then reword comments or don't post at all. Simple. I know there are some out there who say "well, I don't hold my tongue for no one"...well it's the right thing to do to avoid unnecessary conflict. How do you want to be treated by others? It's the right thing to do.

 

[Susanne]

This whole discussion makes me sad.

1. Specktra is not just a chat, yes, but

Specktra is a MAC cosmetics fan community with discussion open to all cosmetic lines and to all who are interested in cosmetics! We promote a healthy atmosphere comprised of education, diversity, and sharing information freely with each other. All of these elements come together to form a supportive and informative forum community.

A fan communtity includes chatting for me. I want to know who I talk to if I talk about my passion MAC. I haven't got anyone at home who shares my love for MAC - why not getting to know more people here who can understand me? And if it is in a discussion thread, why not?

2. I guess there will be something like a FAQ section in the color story information thread soon - a great opportunity for those who just want a quick answer.

3. I don't think we have cliques here - every new or old member is invited and welcome to chat and talk with all of us. 10 times a day or once a week.
I am here since two years now and have met so many different people here - some stay longer and go with you all the time, some just a few months or just a week. There hasn't been one yet I have not talked to if we are in a discussion.

4. What is the point with the thanks button? Use it or use it not.

How can you say we would support those girls with more "thanks" or always share their opinions?? I don't know if I should cry or laugh about it.

I fact I use the thanks button for every post I appreciate, I agree on or just to show: I like that. No matter if my "thanks" is the 1st one or the 20,000st one.
Every "thanks" from me is unique. It is part of our communication here. Not a competition.

 

[ginger9]

I'm not a newbie been a member since 2006, by all means not a veteran but I've been around for a while.

Personally, just from my experience the tone has changed in the sense that I find topics and chatter sections don't capture my interest any more (again just my personal opinion and I know it's a makeup forum so what can I expect) but when I first started I LOVED this forum because it was about more than makeup. It was about so many things - race, relations with women & men, our struggles both internal and external, there was a lot of deeply debated topics and I was educated, inspired and moved by a lot of them. Maybe I've grown apart as well, but I find that there's less topics I engage in now. It's not a complaint but just my feeling. Also it's not a bad thing because people change, times change and forums change.

 

[Susanne]

I really have the wish to tell Janice and all of you:

I do not think specktra has changed in any way. I am here since two years now, almost every day and enjoy it as much as I have always done.

I personally buy a lot of MAC every month. But I have never had the feeling here: You must buy this or that! Get it!
Everyone is free to decide: Do I like it? Will I wear it? I personally don't like lipsticks or neutral colours. You can't talk me into them.
If you follow me in the discussion threads you know I make my lists very early what I want from a new collection and stick to them.

I am convinced everyone is respected here in the same way no matter how many MAC l/s, e/s or blushes someone has.
We can just say how we like a product or what we look forward to, but everyone has a personal financial situation at home and knows best what they can afford and what not.

My opinion is: We should not influence each other here in any direction: Don't say: Get this! But neither: Don't get too much!

 

[hello_kitty]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sass Well said, I totally agree. I hope Janice doesn't pull the plug though. If the color threads are the only issues this community has (besides the Clearance Bin eeeeek) then there are really no issues here. Members just need to think about what they are going to post before they post it. Evaluate whether it's a good idea to post said comments...by asking one's self "is what I am about to say will possibly offend someone?" If yes, then reword comments or don't post at all. Simple. I know there are some out there who say "well, I don't hold my tongue for no one"...well it's the right thing to do to avoid unnecessary conflict. How do you want to be treated by others? It's the right thing to do.

I sincerely hope Janice doesn't even have 1% of the issues I had running a car forum, I wouldn't wish it on anyone. So there would be no reason to pull the plug! With me I had people turning up at places they knew where I would be so they could "spy" on me, and then go talk about a bunch of BS and stuff, and it got really creepy. And all the hate sites and what not. People get too insane about things... cars, makeup, whatever... it's not worth getting that worked up over and trying to cause harm to someone's life, right?

I've been on tons of forums for tons of subjects (cars to gymnastics to purebred cats, and things in between) and this forum has probably the fewest amounts of issues/drama out of most I've been on. But like I've said, I don't follow color collection threads, so I might be missing something, along with enabling issues. I kinda stick to myself and have a relatively low post count, and try to hold back my fingers on subjects of controversy where differing opinions are not welcomed.

Anything like a thanks system can be abused - that's the risk of features like it, but I think the benefits can outweigh the negatives. There's lots of great people on here that go out of their way to provide content, and I think it's great I award a thanks to them to show my appreciation. I'm not a big poster, so clicking a button is nice sometimes.

 

[Susanne]

I remember a lot I guess.

Also this thread from last year.

http://www.specktra.net/forum/f179/r...ecktra-111062/

For me it is still so true!

 

[SakurasamaLover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbella Great point, Leelee. Go to page 31 of the Magic, Mirth, and Mystery colour story. It is a PERFECT example of people acting like a clique and being snarky simply because others stated their opinions. Instead of trying to be aware of their actions and/or words, it has been decided that underhanded comments and "eyerolling" is a much more productive way to deal with things.

Could you please tell which comment you saw as snarky? I reread it all and seriously I don't see where.

As for this Forum I think it's good to put a mission and objective for the website so moderator can moderate and people behave in a certain way but... The fact that a Forum is a successful one is how it is maintained 'alive'. I understand that all people don't want to invest a large numbers of hours a week chatting here about makeup and what not but they shouldn't blame other people for doing it. They are what make this site so speacial. You need key individuals for all great forums to run, that's why not all forum works and not all survive. There needs to be a stable way for all individuals to use this website and I think it's already here.

Why someone would feel rejected if they aren't as talked to as someone who's here 'x' hours a day? Don't, it's just normal... I've always seen a friendly forum, as every other social place people have to moderate their behavior so anyone can find a place.

A key is to have good moderators who are impartial, nobody really is but you know what I mean. Oh and of course; good new posts with new information : an other reason why you need some very active members.


On that note : very happy the forum is up and alive! Thanks Janice for your tremendous work.

 

[euphrosyne_rose]

Hmmm... the topic of enabling caught my eye and it seems to be a touchy subject so all I have to say is this: since I joined Specktra, have I bought more stuff than I normally would? Yes. Do I think that's because of other members? Yes. Do I blame those members for it? No. I buy things because of ME not because of someone else but it is true that I am more likely to buy it if I see good reviews on it or how it looks on a person with features similiar to my own. That's not to say I go out and buy EVERY single thing I like either. Not being close to a Sephora or a MAC or a NARS counter or whatever other brands I like makes it difficult to shop for things and I don't enjoy buying things based on swatches from the sites unless I have already seen the item and KNOW what it looks like. Having people on here who will take the time and effort to do an FOTD or do swatches or even just give a simple review makes things alot easier and I appreciate their willingness to go the lengths they do to talk about/show a product. I'm not going to blame them for it when it's ME who decides to spend that extra bit of money!

When it comes to the cliques, that's going to happen no matter what forum or site you go to. It happens. I went back and looked at some pages of color discussion threads (which I don't usually read) and I do see where some people would think it's a clique but unless I'm missing totally rude comments, all I see is the chatter that is common in the threads that have been mentioned already on here. If you become friends with someone on here, you're going to comment back and forth when you start seeing their posts and they see yours. I guess like I said before that maybe I don't see the "clique" part of it b/c I'm not always an active participant in all the threads and topics. I've never had anyone act rudely towards me for an opinion or question and I'm sorry for all those who have that experience b/c Specktra has never struck me as that sort of place but stuff happens.

I also agree on the comments about complaining about the site being down if you don't support it. Sure I've been disappointed the last few days it was down but I'm not going to go badmouthing the site in the meantime, especially when it could've been a problem that couldn't be helped. The "information superhighway" is far from perfect. Thanks to Janice for working her butt off to get it back on track!!

Again, I enjoy this site more than any other I've visited or been a member of.
The clearance bin is the only sore point for me right now but that's just been for the past few months. Things might just be in a down cycle right now and hopefully things will get better. I hope we can all work things out and make it even better than it already is.

 

[banana1234]

oh no, i go away from this thread for an day or so and when i come back to read all the posts its turned into arguement

didnt janice say if you had problems with specific people or incidents you should pm her not broad cast it all over the thread?

it makes me sad that people have to make it personal, i'm sure everyone has made a comment that has been misinterperated at some point! why do you have to make it PERSONAL?!

ps thank you janice for all your hard work on this forum lately i hope it is smooth sailing from now on

 

[Sass]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hello_kitty I sincerely hope Janice doesn't even have 1% of the issues I had running a car forum, I wouldn't wish it on anyone. So there would be no reason to pull the plug! With me I had people turning up at places they knew where I would be so they could "spy" on me, and then go talk about a bunch of BS and stuff, and it got really creepy. And all the hate sites and what not. People get too insane about things... cars, makeup, whatever... it's not worth getting that worked up over and trying to cause harm to someone's life, right? I've been on tons of forums for tons of subjects (cars to gymnastics to purebred cats, and things in between) and this forum has probably the fewest amounts of issues/drama out of most I've been on. But like I've said, I don't follow color collection threads, so I might be missing something, along with enabling issues. I kinda stick to myself and have a relatively low post count, and try to hold back my fingers on subjects of controversy where differing opinions are not welcomed. Anything like a thanks system can be abused - that's the risk of features like it, but I think the benefits can outweigh the negatives. There's lots of great people on here that go out of their way to provide content, and I think it's great I award a thanks to them to show my appreciation. I'm not a big poster, so clicking a button is nice sometimes.

I used to own a very active wedding forums. Ha! So you can imagine the competition and drama in that one. People were just outright mean...your dress is not cute or your favors look really cheap or you are so dumb for buying a 5,000 dollar dress and etc. etc. Plus, the battle with other wedding sites was a nightmare. I miss those days!! LOL!! It was so childish that I found myself banning more than communicating with my community. I had to give that baby up and also the other Admins of other boards decided to give it up too. Even the biggest wedding board Ultimate Weddings (over 100k members) even went off line after 9 years running. Enough was enough.

Anyway, I no longer own anything but I am a Technical Admin for a big board (I don't get in with the community stuff because it's too hectic). I do participate in lots of other forums from Disney to Fitness to Scrapbooking to Conspiracy Theory to Politics to Candy Wrappers although I had to leave that one because there was some competition drama in that one.

I am so sorry to be going off topic, but my point is that there are lots of personalities online and just like in real life we have to all learn to get along. That's it. Members have to understand that it puts so much unnecessary pressure on the Admin. The bickering breaks her heart while she tries to keep the site up and running for all to use. Can we just forget about the past and move on?? I hope so.

Oh and I remember getting into yelling matches with other coders about the Thank You hack when it was in development. I asked for more sophisticated controls for it and since I was a girl (not to say that women coders are not respected), but male coders do not cater to us at all. They just code a hack for certain types of boards and that's it. TY hack is genius, but it leads to a lot of issues a lot of the time and from being on the Admin forums I know for sure. But like I said before the TY hack is just a tool and yep, it can be abused.

 

[Janice]

I'm going to call for a time out here, please. Let's take a deep breath and realize we are all very passionate about the forum. I admire this passion, but I would hate for it to be turned into an argument because the in the heat of debate something is taken personally.

Let's take a break for a few minutes and recognize that we are talking our problems out, and not attacking one another. We are mostly adults here, and I hope that we can continue to compose ourselves like the sophisticated, intelligent ladies (and gents) we are.

 

[capmorlovesmac]

I was thinking a lot about what made me feel that Specktra has changed. I couldn't name it a few days ago but now I think that it's not Specktra that has changed.. the people have changed. In a difficult time like this where we or people we know have more worries the personal situations have changed.

The raves about products have always been there, the enabling was always a part of the Color Collections threads. But if we have more worries we are more sensitive about it.
What earlier was understood as a funny rave about a product now is bad enabling and I can't excuse myself from thinking like this too. Because my situation has changed I react more sensitive and if I can't buy a product I get sad. But.. if I am being honest to myself.. this is my problem. If I have to blame anyone I should blame myself and this is not easy for me to admit.

 

[banana1234]

i would miss the raving if it went, because i feel like i'd miss possible brilliant products by perhaps over looking them when i look at the collections...
i often go for bright shiny sparkly things and miss the great blushes, msfs and bases.. i like knowing that a large volume of the forum like one particular product, makes me go back and look again